why did God kill the first born of the Eqyptians?
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Originally posted by Great Heavens!:
And you simply can't convince me that there's this Big Bang theory.
I didn't expect you to believe. Like we agreed on, we have different views.
Placebo effect? I've personally seen people walking out of their wheelchair, blind seeing, deaf hearing and many more. You can google or wiki this too. Or, go to a healing crusade/event to witness it yourself like I did. :)
miracles healing should perform in the hospital instead of on stage if it is true because all the real patients are in hospital, certified by the doctors that they are really disabled. invite non christians to witness the healing perform on the patients selected by non christians, that will be more convincing.
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Originally posted by Cck689461:
psychiatrist discharged me already how to go back n see him. I lastime have anxiety but was cured now.Skin doc also discharged me. Cured of skin illness. My problem is hives severe form. have to be on medicine til i die.
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
yes big bang is a theory and not proven, thats why it is called generally accepted theory in the scientific community. but then u expect me to believe that a divine being created the earth in a mere 6 days?
you witnessed? where, when, what? do u think i believe your words than the placebo effect appearing in reputable science journals and periodicals.
next time if there is a miracle healing, pls call up the reporters and tell them to report this in the newspapers. anyone can say anything they want. can you get your miracle healer to cure of cancers, HIV, heart diseases and so forth. if you can do that, then I will believe you.
Just google and find your own reports.
http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/370291.aspx
I already said I didn't expect you to believe. Look, there's no need to argue. Like I always said, we have different religious views. The faith Christians have, you must experience it yourself first hand. You can never experience anything sitting behind your computer and asking questions in a forum. Go out there, study it yourself.
About animals, dude. Do some work yourself.
http://www.answers2prayer.org/bible_questions/Answers/animals/pets.html
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An eternal now most true ex buddhists convert to christian cos buddhism is the world hardest religion.
Even its basics five precepts is hard enough let alone harder stuff like meditation.
A lot of ppl i known who gave up on buddhism cos it's too hard for them. They nt necessarily become christians some become free thinker.
Not arguing with u AEN. Only speaking my mind. No offense to u and buddhism.
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Originally posted by Fairyfairy86:
miracles healing should perform in the hospital instead of on stage if it is true because all the real patients are in hospital, certified by the doctors that they are really disabled. invite non christians to witness the healing perform on the patients selected by non christians, that will be more convincing.
You can never expect healing to happen when there's no faith.
If God is willing, sure, anything is possible. :)
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Originally posted by Great Heavens!:
Just google and find your own reports.
http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/370291.aspx
I already said I didn't expect you to believe. Look, there's no need to argue. Like I always said, we have different religious views. The faith Christians have, you must experience it yourself first hand. You can never experience anything sitting behind your computer and asking questions in a forum. Go out there, study it yourself.
About animals, dude. Do some work yourself.
http://www.answers2prayer.org/bible_questions/Answers/animals/pets.html
Yup no point arguing.
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actually buddhism points me towards christianality.
Because when i was a buddhist I everyday break precepts many times. I lied and gossiped and other offense. Then when ppl invited me to church and introduced the sinful nature of human, I agreed instantly because I break precepts everyday.
Christian called it commandments.
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Originally posted by Great Heavens!:
You can never expect healing to happen when there's no faith.
If God is willing, sure, anything is possible. :)
Faith is pre requiste. Not say with ur mouth i believe but mind waver. -
Originally posted by Great Heavens!:
You can never expect healing to happen when there's no faith.
If God is willing, sure, anything is possible. :)
ya sure go heal those who has cancer and HIV. ya right. -
Originally posted by -StarDust-:
An eternal now most true ex buddhists convert to christian cos buddhism is the world hardest religion.
Even its basics five precepts is hard enough let alone harder stuff like meditation.
A lot of ppl i known who gave up on buddhism cos it's too hard for them. They nt necessarily become christians some become free thinker.
Not arguing with u AEN. Only speaking my mind. No offense to u and buddhism.
ya sure, go and take the easier route to heaven
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Originally posted by -StarDust-:
An eternal now most true ex buddhists convert to christian cos buddhism is the world hardest religion.
Even its basics five precepts is hard enough let alone harder stuff like meditation.
A lot of ppl i known who gave up on buddhism cos it's too hard for them. They nt necessarily become christians some become free thinker.
Not arguing with u AEN. Only speaking my mind. No offense to u and buddhism.
I also break precepts sometimes.
The point about Buddhism is not to be a perfect human. Nobody is that perfect, unless you're Buddha.
It is just being good enough (so that you arent living in guilt and the consequence of your bad karma that obscures your practice to attain enlightenment) so that you can practice and attain enlightenment. The goal is to attain enlightenment. The goal is liberation from suffering, not perfect morality.
And the thing is - it works, many people did attain enlightenment even today.
Anyway meditation is really not that hard - it is actually very enjoyable, if you practice after some time you'll find it so.
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Originally posted by An Eternal Now:
I also break precepts sometimes.
The point about Buddhism is not to be a perfect human. Nobody is that perfect, unless you're Buddha.
It is just being good enough (so that you arent living in guilt and the consequence of your bad karma that obscures your practice to attain enlightenment) so that you can practice and attain enlightenment. The goal is to attain enlightenment. The goal is liberation from suffering, not perfect morality.
And the thing is - it works, many people did attain enlightenment even today.
Anyway meditation is really not that hard - it is actually very enjoyable, if you practice after some time you'll find it so.
Erm I am not into buddhism now. No point telling me this. I m a christian. Not interested in liberation n meditation.Thanks nevertheless.
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Originally posted by An Eternal Now:
I also break precepts sometimes.
The point about Buddhism is not to be a perfect human. Nobody is that perfect, unless you're Buddha.
It is just being good enough (so that you arent living in guilt and the consequence of your bad karma that obscures your practice to attain enlightenment) so that you can practice and attain enlightenment. The goal is to attain enlightenment. The goal is liberation from suffering, not perfect morality.
And the thing is - it works, many people did attain enlightenment even today.
Anyway meditation is really not that hard - it is actually very enjoyable, if you practice after some time you'll find it so.
I dun chose a religion I cannot do. One should chose a religion that he can follow not chose a super hard religion.I cannot be unattached when doing charity work like wad diamond sutra says. I do charity work I felt a sense of wonderful achievement and I will keep on thinking abt the wonderful work i have done.
Therefore I am not interested in buddhism anymore.
I dont care how many ppl attain liberation. I am not interested. Same for meditation I have no interest.
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
ya sure, go and take the easier route to heaven
Erm everyone is free to find their way to heaven. I believe Jesus is the way the truth and the life. -
Originally posted by -StarDust-:
actually buddhism points me towards christianality.
Because when i was a buddhist I everyday break precepts many times. I lied and gossiped and other offense. Then when ppl invited me to church and introduced the sinful nature of human, I agreed instantly because I break precepts everyday.
Christian called it commandments.
yah lah, becoz they give you false promises of an easy way out mah ! no need to control yourself also can go heaven !
but think about it !
CAN YOU GET TO THE TOP OF A MOUNTAIN BY SITTING AT THE BOTTOM ?
the Christian way is like those internet scams that promise you tons of money...........all for the price of $39.90..............if you order in the next 15 minutes !
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Anyway buddhism is beyond my ability to follow. No point following it.
I like christianality especially the sinful nature thing. I agreed with it more.
We are born with a sinful nature we are sinners.
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All eternal now can post liberation and enlightenment here on eternal hope we go buddhist forum promote christianality how would he feel?
Dun post liberation and buddhism stuff on this forum. U like ppl go buddhism forum to promote Jesus christ?
Must self respect each other religions ma. For me I din go AEN forum promote christianality.
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Originally posted by An Eternal Now:
I also break precepts sometimes.
The point about Buddhism is not to be a perfect human. Nobody is that perfect, unless you're Buddha.
It is just being good enough (so that you arent living in guilt and the consequence of your bad karma that obscures your practice to attain enlightenment) so that you can practice and attain enlightenment. The goal is to attain enlightenment. The goal is liberation from suffering, not perfect morality.
And the thing is - it works, many people did attain enlightenment even today.
Anyway meditation is really not that hard - it is actually very enjoyable, if you practice after some time you'll find it so.
Meditation is not easy for all people. U can meditate does not mean others can.Liberation not all are interested in it. I am not interested in it.
Karma not all ppl believe in karma. Even some non christians free thinkers dun believe in karma and rebirth. Some of my frenz ( not christians) also dun believe in it.
I dun believe in perfect human beings either.
I dun believe in buddhism precepts.
I dun believe in existence of buddha, bodhisttavas and arhats.
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Irregardless I feel that An Eternal Now is just sharing certain aspects of Buddhism under the context in this particular thread.
Its no harm understanding what it's about, so you will be able to understand thier point of view. So you will know where there is a clash in "truths".
To opinionate, discuss, refute or rebutt something , you must truly understanding what it is about first. Its like how one has to understand the law... to break the law. LOL!
Thats how I feel at least.
But of course there is a limit to where information begins and conversion ends.
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Its understandable that when one experiences something, they will naturally want to express it.
Expression is but one of the things that drive people want to share their feelings and thoughts.
If we cant express it, we might as well dont believe it.
Imagine you cant even express how tasty this chicken tastes like because the other person doesnt agree with u that the chicken tastes yummy and instead restricts you from expressing yourself. And they call us the intolerant bunch.
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Originally posted by An Eternal Now:
The LORD is a jealous and avenging God; the LORD takes vengeance and is filled with wrath. The LORD takes vengeance on his foes and maintains his wrath against his enemies
Wrong. It is not a biblical fact. This is the problem when verses are taken out of context by non believers (intentional or otherwise).
In the same chapter, if you read further on, it also says that “the LORD is slow to anger and great in power and the Lord will by no means clear the guilty” and later, “he Lord is good, a stronghold in the day of trouble; he knows those who take refuge in him.”
Why do people tend to quote mine the scriptures for verses that will support their case (actually none) when they don’t want to acknowledge the other verses that declare God is also loving, righteous and just? You know these people are cherry picking when they deliberately quote verses out of context and deride the Christian God (as this thread has shown). Strangely enough, I’ve yet to come across a non believer who will highlight the verses in Scriptures that describe a loving God and use the example of Christ’s atonement to praise Him for His love and mercies. Actually not true also. In this case after they do, they usually come to faith. Haha…
So if one wants to affirm the truth of one verse, one has to affirm the truth of the other verses found in the other parts too. Especially if they’re talking about the same thing.
Secondly, the OT was written in biblical Hebrew, not English. It’s easy to use our modern mindset to interpret it, and the word, ‘vengeance” has very negative connotations for us (immorality, cruelty, arbitratriness). However, in the OT, the concept of vengeance has a positive connotation, and has to do with lawfuness, justice and salvation. Most of the time when it’s used in other texts during that time, very few instances is the term used of blood vengeance on the part of an individual. Most of the time it refers to judgment of a group or God to defend one of its/his own. In all cases, the use of vengeful to describe God is wrong.
Similarly, the idea of wrath/anger is often misinterpreted in the same spirit. While human wrath is destructive, the wrath of God refers to the moral outrage at true atrocity. Not a level that is easily reached like a hissy fit, as seen that God is ‘slow to anger’, but wrath is often used biblically as “the vigorous and welfare-motivated intervention by the Royal God, in breaking oppression and delivering His "dependents", by forceful removal of the habitually and aggressively treacherous from their lives, and by a re-structured reality, characterized by blessing and peace for the good.” As in the earlier example of the Israelites living in misery in Egypt, under the slave drivers and poor work conditions, God rescued them from the hands of the Egyptians to bring them to a better place.
To be sure, to claim that God is ‘angry’ or ‘vengeful’ by drawing inferences from verses randomly without a biblical context and understanding demonstrates a misrepresentation of the Christian God and Christianity.
If people are keen in criticizing other religions, they do need an audience. You can't actually go to the parliament, or a church, a christian fellowship, to criticize their faith. Why? Wrong audience. Wrong venue.
We might be understanding ‘criticizing’ differently, I understand it to be more of an evaluation, as in “criticizing an essay”. In that sense, one evaluates the pros and cons for the benefit of himself, not others, hence no audience required.
If one has already decided to follow a certain faith and is practicing his faith at a rather deep level, how can you expect anything to change his mind?
Through logic and reasoning. Some non theists in this forum claim to employ their faculties to perform these functions but don’t seem consistent. For example, the late Antony Flew “followed the evidence” to move from atheism to deism. To be closed off to all sound use of logic and reasoning and remain in one’s faulty beliefs indicates that one is close minded or fundamentalist at best.
They will attempt to support faith with logic, but logic and arguments will not easily move the believers' faith away. The faith is deeper than logic.
For example, can you claim to understand completely how God works or his plans for man? Didn't they say that God works in mysterious ways? Yet you have faith in Him, right?
That is why I said believers put faith ahead of logic, not that they are totally illogical or discard logic.
We differ on this point.
Because logic as described as “the principles of correct thinking” helps a person to develop a worldview and life view as well as in the pursuit of truth. Since God is truth, it follows that the use of logic is not divorced from faith in understanding God and to please Him. Biblical faith isn’t blind or mystical but requires knowledge. The Greek word of pistis means the result of being persuaded to believe something is true, even if it hasn’t happened yet or cannot see. Persuasion here is intricately related to the use of logic.
It actually depends. If one explores the mystical and contemplative core of religions, there is a lot to agree with mutually. If you are a true mystic that goes beyond the realm of concepts, beliefs, blind faith, into true experience, one will start to see a lot of commonalities.
Hmm… still disagree. Truth is exclusive by definition. I’m sure there are common grounds but commonality doesn’t negate the exclusivity of truth. Fundamentals are the same because God has revealed Himself in the general creation but the conclusions reached are different. If I affirm the truth that Christ said He is the only way to God, by definition, I must exclude all other claims to God. Doesn’t sound politically correct but at least it’s intellectually honest.
Then again, I’m not into blind faith and mysticism. I think the idea of promoting blind faith has done plenty of damage to Christian believers. The verses Christian mystics use tend to be misquoted or without a prior understanding of scriptures. Personal take is that most of the time, the mystic side of Christianity tends to confuse and confound with the use of flowery words to describe a subjective experiential event.
Buddhism rejects an ultimate substance or source... Buddhism is certainly less exclusive than some religions (like, believe this or you're going to hell, etc).
We differ on this. Christianity affirms the existence of an “ultimate substance’ – truth. I quote Ronald Nash’s book, Faith and Reason, pg 162 – 164.
I have been away for a long time. Just came back and I noticed so much trolling and bashing around from some forumers. Cannot possibly have a good discussion without the thread being hijacked. haha...My question to you is, do you see much 'changing of minds' in those who are 'deep into their beliefs' going on in sgForums lately?
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Originally posted by BadzMaro:
Irregardless I feel that An Eternal Now is just sharing certain aspects of Buddhism under the context in this particular thread.
Its no harm understanding what it's about, so you will be able to understand thier point of view. So you will know where there is a clash in "truths".
To opinionate, discuss, refute or rebutt something , you must truly understanding what it is about first. Its like how one has to understand the law... to break the law. LOL!
Thats how I feel at least.
But of course there is a limit to where information begins and conversion ends.
did you mean where conversion begins and information end? =)
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Originally posted by Great Heavens!:
You can never expect healing to happen when there's no faith.
If God is willing, sure, anything is possible. :)
I have seen faithful Christians dying young. I believe you do.How do you explain that? I believe you will say God's will.
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Originally posted by Great Heavens!:
You can never expect healing to happen when there's no faith.
If God is willing, sure, anything is possible. :)
Faith? Yes, one needs to have faith where healing is concerned. Don't forget that God's will supersedes faith. Even if one has the faith to be healed and unfortunately it is not within God's will he be healed, ultimately he will not be healed.Problem is generally christians always think that 1 + 1 = 2 and this is not always true where God is concerned. Everything is God in Christianity. Even God chooses to favour Israel, nobody dare to oppose Him.
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Originally posted by Pinknutri:
I have seen faithful Christians dying young. I believe you do.How do you explain that? I believe you will say God's will.
Go read my reply to Great Heavens. It is not always about faith where healing is concerned.A crappy faith indeed.