Why christainity is a real religion
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Originally posted by Fortmax777:
No offence but sorry to inform you that this is not true in the case of Christianity. If you do not accept Christ by faith then thats where you are going. Nothing a man can do to go to heaven for all man have sinned and therefore fall short of the glory of God.
You cannot enter by works but only by grace (i.e. getting what you do not deserve - the free gift of Christ)
As I mentioned before in another thread.
Hate = Murder - Hell
Lust = Adultery - Hell
Lie (White Lies Included) = False Witness - Hell
Does anyone still think they pass the test??
thats the thing you see, its exclusivity to its own faith and believers only. no wonder people are put off by this type of dogma. to me, this is akin like instilling fear and membership entry to its own country club, where members get to admit and non members, you can go to hell. religion using fear, is akin to a parent instilling fear so that the children toe the line, which its motivation and purpose is on the wrong approach. I cant and wont accept this type of dogma, as it is devoid of logic and compassion.
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
thats the thing you see, its exclusivity to its own faith and believers only. no wonder people are put off by this type of dogma. to me, this is akin like instilling fear and membership entry to its own country club, where members get to admit and non members, you can go to hell. religion using fear, is akin to a parent instilling fear so that the children toe the line, which its motivation and purpose is on the wrong approach. I cant and wont accept this type of dogma, as it is devoid of logic and compassion.
Hi Rooney9,That is what is written in the Holy scriptures. It is not the law of a country or man. It is the law of God and we are subject to it. The Bible is infallible and inerrant in its account. By the Bible here I am referring to the original Manuscripts (eg the original Hebrew texts (O.T) and Greek Texts (N.T)). Further, if you did some research, you will find that the resurrection of Christ cannot be denied based on archaeological evidence and his ascension is even written about in non-Christian secular historical records.
In fact his empty tomb is still there in the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem. And it is this same guy who rose from the dead who validates and affirms the Scriptures.
God's law is law and he does not have to succumb his laws to our human definition of logic and justice. HIS justice is supreme and while he has all rights to condemn the entire world he did not. Out of grace, he chose to come and die for us so that we can be saved if we accept and repent. Its that simple and that free - acknowledge that he has taken your punishment in your place and confess your sins to him and you are there.
He is not asking us to do anything ridiculous (sacrifice our children, become a recluse, live a perfect life without sin etc). He is aking that we accept the punishment he has bore for us.
Imagine if you had a huge mortgage you cannot pay off and your house is about to be possessed by the bank. This guy comes along, pays off your mortgage in full and even leaves some money so you can enjoy the rest of your life. The banks condition is that you signed an acknoledgement that you are free of debt with no strings attached. Would you sign it or question this guy's sense of justice?? Would you tell him that you do not think it is fair unless he immediately pays off the debts of everyone else you would not accept??
We are in no position to judge God or apply our principles to him we are accountable to him but he is not accountable to us. We can only be thankful and appreciate whatever blessings he chooses to shower upon us.
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Originally posted by Fortmax777:
Hi Rooney9,That is what is written in the Holy scriptures. It is not the law of a country or man. It is the law of God and we are subject to it. The Bible is infallible and inerrant in its account. By the Bible here I am referring to the original Manuscripts (eg the original Hebrew texts (O.T) and Greek Texts (N.T)). Further, if you did some research, you will find that the resurrection of Christ cannot be denied based on archaeological evidence and his ascension is even written about in non-Christian secular historical records.
In fact his empty tomb is still there in the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem. And it is this same guy who rose from the dead who validates and affirms the Scriptures.
God's law is law and he does not have to succumb his laws to our human definition of logic and justice. HIS justice is supreme and while he has all rights to condemn the entire world he did not. Out of grace, he chose to come and die for us so that we can be saved if we accept and repent. Its that simple and that free - acknowledge that he has taken your punishment in your place and confess your sins to him and you are there.
He is not asking us to do anything ridiculous (sacrifice our children, become a recluse, live a perfect life without sin etc). He is aking that we accept the punishment he has bore for us.
Imagine if you had a huge mortgage you cannot pay off and your house is about to be possessed by the bank. This guy comes along, pays off your mortgage in full and even leaves some money so you can enjoy the rest of your life. The banks condition is that you signed an acknoledgement that you are free of debt with no strings attached. Would you sign it or question this guy's sense of justice?? Would you tell him that you do not think it is fair unless he immediately pays off the debts of everyone else you would not accept??
We are in no position to judge God or apply our principles to him we are accountable to him but he is not accountable to us. We can only be thankful and appreciate whatever blessings he chooses to shower upon us.
dude, think about this. let's say i am a computer guy. i write a dota map with AI to play. i upload it. OOPS crap, players can choose whether to play sentinels or scourge. even though i allowed them the choice, they are not supposed to play scourge! hence i shall blame the dota map for ALL time.
then i see, wah, the dota map is getting from bad to worse, i shall use virtual reality to go into warcraft 3 as one of their characters (let's choose Zeus! i like Zeus) and be both by parthanogenesis and tell the characters to REPENT, for the end is near. i shall then virtually die for them in the game and go to the altar of kings to resurrect myself, thus showing myself that i am superior to them.
btw, virgin birth is not specific to jesus christ. egyptian and hindu gods have been using that story way before abrahamic faiths. resurrection from the dead isn't new, research why a funeral is often called a "wake".
also, your story is flawed. this should be the full story. imagine you are staying in your own house. a man comes along and says that "hey, the house you are living in is mine. do nothing and you will not have to pay anything and be able to be still living in the house, but you will burn in the pits of hell for all time! or you could pay me by worshipping the ground i walk on, and join me in heaven after you die." would you believe in such a person, or chase him out for being a lunatic?
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Originally posted by Fortmax777:
Will real parents condemn their naughty children to hell if they have committed sins like what you have mentioned above.? God is just like parents, He is loving and compassionate. He is like parents who will try all means to save their children and make them repent. One will go to hell because of the sins one committed not because God has condemned them but this is the law of nature (karma) which neither God nor Buddha has control over it or can they overrule it.
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If i have no faith in god no matter how much good deeds i go, i will go to hell
i go kill someone tomorrow then convert
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Aiyo.. Laurence how can like that. Your intention is so clear and u know about it... salvation for that kind of thing is for those that do not know about it. You cant claim self-defence, when your intention was to kill from the beginning without any threat towards you.. cannot cannot..
There is.. but another way...
lol!
But... God being Almighty and All Knowing... dun think its going to work... damn..
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no no i must have faith in jesus
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Originally posted by BadzMaro:
Aiyo.. Laurence how can like that. Your intention is so clear and u know about it... salvation for that kind of thing is for those that do not know about it. You cant claim self-defence, when your intention was to kill from the beginning without any threat towards you.. cannot cannot..
There is.. but another way...
lol!
But... God being Almighty and All Knowing... dun think its going to work... damn..
God is impotent and imposcient. -
Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:
God is impotent and imposcient.God has erectile dysfunction?! o.O
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Originally posted by Fortmax777:
Hi Rooney9,That is what is written in the Holy scriptures. It is not the law of a country or man. It is the law of God and we are subject to it. The Bible is infallible and inerrant in its account. By the Bible here I am referring to the original Manuscripts (eg the original Hebrew texts (O.T) and Greek Texts (N.T)). Further, if you did some research, you will find that the resurrection of Christ cannot be denied based on archaeological evidence and his ascension is even written about in non-Christian secular historical records.
In fact his empty tomb is still there in the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem. And it is this same guy who rose from the dead who validates and affirms the Scriptures.
God's law is law and he does not have to succumb his laws to our human definition of logic and justice. HIS justice is supreme and while he has all rights to condemn the entire world he did not. Out of grace, he chose to come and die for us so that we can be saved if we accept and repent. Its that simple and that free - acknowledge that he has taken your punishment in your place and confess your sins to him and you are there.
He is not asking us to do anything ridiculous (sacrifice our children, become a recluse, live a perfect life without sin etc). He is aking that we accept the punishment he has bore for us.
Imagine if you had a huge mortgage you cannot pay off and your house is about to be possessed by the bank. This guy comes along, pays off your mortgage in full and even leaves some money so you can enjoy the rest of your life. The banks condition is that you signed an acknoledgement that you are free of debt with no strings attached. Would you sign it or question this guy's sense of justice?? Would you tell him that you do not think it is fair unless he immediately pays off the debts of everyone else you would not accept??
We are in no position to judge God or apply our principles to him we are accountable to him but he is not accountable to us. We can only be thankful and appreciate whatever blessings he chooses to shower upon us.
sorry the laws of god only apply to your faith and the people worshipping your god. I am subjected to the laws of the world I am living in. for me, the truth is universal to all and not belong to some groups or faiths. the bible story and salvation seemed dogmatic and instilling fear, just like buying insurance is to get peace of mind. if your religion need to instil fear in order for others to believe, then its the wrong approach to adopt I reckon. if its the truth, there is no need to instil fear in others. only dictators used fear on his subjects to maintain his power and control of hie autocratic regime.
on a separate note, have you seen god yet? how does he look like? doe he has a form or a wing?
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Originally posted by Dawnfirstlight:
Will real parents condemn their naughty children to hell if they have committed sins like what you have mentioned above.? God is just like parents, He is loving and compassionate. He is like parents who will try all means to save their children and make them repent. One will go to hell because of the sins one committed not because God has condemned them but this is the law of nature (karma) which neither God nor Buddha has control over it or can they overrule it.
yes no parents will have the heart to condemn their child to jail, much less hell isnt it. even the lions and tigers, for all their predatory instinct, wont kill and eat their offsprings. not only this, it breed exclusivity, favouritism and is bias towards other children. if believers, go to heaven, non believers go to hell? so what the hell is this all about? it borders on the absurdity to me. so whats the deal when you say god is merciful and compassionate? is this all merciful and compassionate god when he send non believers aka his children to eternal hell?
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Originally posted by laurence82:
woah, i am abt to say the same thingyou only prove what you propagate, the onus is on you to bring up the evidence and not ask people to prove you something doesnt exist
i said the same thing for multi level marketers many times too when they ask me to prove their products dont work, i mean like harlo, you sell something you jolly well prove it works
didnt it amaze you with how they can come out with this type of reasoning. let me explain to you. the reason is quite simple really. its defence mechanism at work. as they are unable to provide you with evidence, so they tweak this to the other way round. isnt this a fantastic type of logic they can come up with, brilliant aint it.
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
didnt it amaze you with how they can come out with this type of reasoning. let me explain to you. the reason is quite simple really. its defence mechanism at work. as they are unable to provide you with evidence, so they tweak this to the other way round. isnt this a fantastic type of logic they can come up with, brilliant aint it.
yeap yeap
i face this all the time
there are many ways to an argument, you can truthfully and sincerely prove and disprove points
or you come up with something so senseless it shock the other party and you can declare yourself the victor
thats how it goes
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Originally posted by laurence82:
If i have no faith in god no matter how much good deeds i go, i will go to hell
i go kill someone tomorrow then convert
reading this reminds me - when jesus was crucified on the cross, he turned to the two criminals next to him and told them that today they will be with him in paradise.Mixed signals or what.
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
someone accused me of lying that god doesnt exists and ask me for proof? that fellow cited that the bible, men doing god's work like christians charitable organisations are proof that god exists.
shouldnt it be that, since you say god exists, shouldnt the onus be on you to proof rather than vice versa. how am I to show proof when it something does not exist. if god exists, show hand please.
Eh...not accused but telling you out right that you are a liar.....if you cannot back up what you said, then you are a liar....
The main issues are those baseless claims you made which you cannot back up and those that you made due to the fact that you do not know.....
It's really not about God being real or does not exist....
And since you insist that God does not exist, at least give us some proof to show why you said what you did......
And you don't have to agree with what I said but also state your reasons....
and now you are hiding like a coward.
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religious discussion is most of the time in vain, leads to no end in discussion.
mei wan mei liao.
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Originally posted by Happyinfo2:
Eh...not accused but telling you out right that you are a liar.....if you cannot back up what you said, then you are a liar....
The main issues are those baseless claims you made which you cannot back up and those that you made due to the fact that you do not know.....
It's really not about God being real or does not exist....
And since you insist that God does not exist, at least give us some proof to show why you said what you did......
And you don't have to agree with what I said but also state your reasons....
and now you are hiding like a coward.
I am not as big a liar as you are who claimed that science has proven there is a god. I rest my case.
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
I am not as big a liar as you are who claimed that science has proven there is a god. I rest my case.
Ha...ha..ha... you are the big liar as proven time and again and you have to hide like a coward now.....taking pot-shots in a pathetic manner...
Do you have the courage to go back to the old thread to back up all your baseless claims and lies.....which is really the issue.
Go rest your case because you have none in the first place.
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come on guys, argue for or against christianity, or if you want, insult christianity or nontheism. don't flame each other. =P
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From what I know, the reason as to why Christ died on the cross was to free all mankind from the sacrifice of animals, which does not seem to be working as humans, after sacrificing animals each time, will continue to sin again. Thus, God chose to die on the cross instead in order to cover-up for all the sins of man, Which is why if you read on all christian websites, all of them say that no one needs to fear about breaking the ten commandments, as one only needs to believe in Jesus christ- that alone to go to heaven. But I don't think breaking the ten commandments willingly and knowingly is a good idea...
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Originally posted by laurence82:
who will know the birth date, just as who will know where he spent his childhood and teenage years?
why from a pagan festival?
According to Christianity, Jesus himself is God. God created the earth and existed before anyone. He is forever there. So there is no birth date of Jesus.Lots of questions christianity is churning for people. Sigh!
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Christmas ? lol
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Originally posted by martial:
The world celebrates Jesus birthday on christmas and the day that Jesus rose from his grave on good friday. This shows that the world has acknowldeged that Jesus Christ is the real God. No other religious leaders or founder birthday is being celebrated in the world.
The world celebrate christmas is not becoz of jesus, it's just another excuse for us to spurge and and collect presents..has nothing to do with jesus at all..come on..it's a fact! -
Originally posted by ThunderFbolt:
God has erectile dysfunction?! o.O
I believe so too because Satan is the only one who goes around screwing people.LOL -
Originally posted by themoment86:
The world celebrate christmas is not becoz of jesus, it's just another excuse for us to spurge and and collect presents..has nothing to do with jesus at all..come on..it's a fact!
got some idiot post on EH before, why we have St Andrew's Catheral right in middle of Civic Districti told the dickhead its the symbol of British colonialism along with City Hall and Old Supreme Court