Views abt Joseph Prince from New Creation
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Originally posted by Happyinfo2:
Ha..ha..ha..You are right that you are "like killing their own brother/sisters rather then loving each another." - i.e. killing SPDCP....
Killing his desire and opportunity to search and find the truth by asking him to shut his mind! If what he know is the truth, he will not have problems looking and searching around. Only those whose doctrines are "weak and questionable" are afraid to look around.....
SPDCP, decide for yourself who is for you:
1. someone who asked you to shut your mind and stop learning...
2. someone who asked you to open your mind and search around ........and learn what others are doing and teachings and decide which is right to you.
Remember that God gives you a sound mind to discern the truth and only you can do it. To discern, you must open up your mind as the truth is not afraid to be tested. Only falsehood can't and thus need to forget about explaining......
don't twist my meaning,
if he want to go and learn and research go ahead.im not advising him in ANYWAY to stop learning, searching the truth. he should.
i only find him NO NEED for him to explain to you, as you bunch of people already have a certain mindset.
why bother?
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Originally posted by charlize:
I wonder why he changed his name to "Prince" ?
Anybody knows?
it sounds nicersince u cant call urself King
so a bit lower,
call urself prince instead
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Originally posted by charlize:
I wonder why he changed his name to "Prince" ?
Anybody knows?
He changed it for the same reason God changed Jacob's name to Israel.. There is nothing wrong with changing your name, do it if you want... Lots of people have done it for reasons i cant care to mention... why should it be surprising or rather, why is it even other peoples business what his name is?
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Originally posted by SPDCP:
Lol man, are we still on monetary gain? None of the churches pastors recieve anything from the sales of materials/property owned by the church, i believe its been repeated over and over the previous posts..
everything they recieve is from regular remuneration, and from personal offerings like for example if Mr X sends Ps Mark a cheque to bless him.. I do want to add that Ps Mark( all of the other pastors included) doesnt immediately get the cheque, but it is sent to the accounting department for taxes before he recieves it...
When did I touch on that in the last post? Feeling guilty? In fact, in the past post, I said I had no problems with pastors getting piad...infact to be paid well....But what is the yardstick to measure? You don't even know and ask me to ask your church instead.........?? So much for trying to explain misunderstanding about your church.
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Originally posted by SPDCP:
Yes, and like it has also been repeatedly mentioned, we are preaching sunday after sunday of God's love for you and through activities organized by the departments we are reaching out.. Our focus is however, on Jesus.
probably, immediately someone will say : You say you focus on Jesus, but dont do His commands?
To that i reply: I plan to put the Commander first, then the command second.. I dont want to be too caught up in following the command, and then forget who is commanding... Sounds confusing? I'll explain..
Jesus asked the Samaritan woman for a drink. He later went on to say: If you knew who it is who is asking you for a drink, you will ask him, and he will give you ever lasting water...
Did Jesus say " if you know who I am, you will give me a drink?" No, instead He says I will give YOU a drink.. and after the woman left to preach to the 10 cities(decapolis), the disciples found Jesus refreshed as if He was the one who had drunk.. and He said I have food you know not of...
Compare with Martha, who was so busy serving that she forgot who Jesus was, and ended up blaming both Mary and the Lord... :" Lord, dont you care that my sister has left me alone to serve.."
You are confusing yourself and I said many times that I know your church preaches Jesus.....that's not the problem. Every church does that.....
The church preach the Word Of God and lead us to follow His commandment. Is it that simple. So results of love will show.....like the shelter, the homes, hospice etc.....How would people who dedicated time, money and personal scarifices be confused with God because they are "so busy serving"? Tell me which church you know of that falls into that category?
How can one who follow Christ commandent be "too caught up in following the command, and then forget who is commanding" ? Unless you are telling me following Christ might lead you astray.....
On the other hand I am not so sure of one that is operating like a profit orientated organisation.......following Christ??
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Originally posted by SPDCP:
What im trying to say in the end is that NCC stand is : while reaching out is wonderful, its a great work, and missions are excellent and praise-worthy, and giving to the poor is commendable and such.. dont put too much importance on doing things, but prioritize sitting under His feet, and lean on His breast, and focus on His love for you!
All these things are good.. But focus on Jesus and the rest will follow.. We dont preach on missions, but we preach Jesus and the desire to do missions come naturally.. We dont preach giving to the poor, but preach Jesus and the people are generous... We dont preach church growth, but preach Jesus and we grew from 150 to 20000 in 10 years... Who/what am we boasting in? our "ability"? "charisma"? No! We preach Jesus, our boast is in Jesus!
You are somewhat right that you cannot be Christ-like if Christ is not in you. The church and her members who have Christ in them will follow His words of love and reach out to love their neighbours...............not making money which is not the function of a church. Love of money is GREED.
You still harping on the "growth" and "size" of the church.....which I thought by now you should know is not the second largest.............but the most important reason is what and why these people are attracted to the church..... Are they attracted by the calling of God to be a Christian so that they can serve the mission that God gave them? I.E. to love their neighbours? If so, the results after 10 years will show.......
and what others think and voicing displeasure of speaks volume of the results or the lack of it.....
Even cults and terrorist have strong following and they also grow depsite being "persecuted"..........
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Originally posted by SPDCP:
your last verse i will contest by saying that that phrase "not all who call me Lord Lord will enter into the kingdom of Heaven" is out of context.. What use is calling Jesus "Lord Lord" if you have not accepted Him as Saviour? He is Yeshua, which means "saviour" and not "Lord"... Its is like Gandhi saying " i like your Christ, but i dont like your people... always stabbing each other in the back and fighting among yourselves..." ... Gandhi acknowledges Jesus is great, but he does not believe in Jesus as Saviour..
But for Christians, they have been saved.. Jesus is not someone who gives half-half work...
God bless.
Out of context? He also said that only those who heard His words and act on it will enter into the Kingdom of God.....
Who else will call Jesus Lord unless they are His believers and followers?
As I said, it is because of His death that brought us the rewards of eternal life....but He came to save the world. So this is available to ALL mankind provided they listen to His words and act on it. I.E. only true Christians who are converted in their hearts to one that is of love, charity and compassion as He said in the last judgement (MT25).
So not all who claimed to be Christians are saved.....otherwise why would He said what He did (as above)? And why would Paul said what he did (in my previous post)? So you decide who lied to you.
Regardless if you take the Catholic version that one is saved by faith and deeds or the Protestants version that one is saved to do good deeds, it will matches up in the end. If you said you are Christian and yet have no deeds to show, than what James said in chapter 2 is clear about such "faith".
Why would one have faith in Christ and yet do not follow His commandments?
And don't go on arguing what is good deeds and how many is needed etc.....because when one is truely converted in their hearts, good deeds comes naturally as part and parcel of their life...never a chore and never need to count. You don't count how many times you breathes although that is what keeps you alive.
More importanly, as Christian good deeds is our pirority as God commanded us. Not making money which I said again, is not the function of any church.
How would Jesus's work be "half-half" if He saves only people who listen to His words and act on it (especially when He said them clearly in the Gospel) ??
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Originally posted by SPDCP:
He changed it for the same reason God changed Jacob's name to Israel.. There is nothing wrong with changing your name, do it if you want... Lots of people have done it for reasons i cant care to mention... why should it be surprising or rather, why is it even other peoples business what his name is?
I don't think he is saying that there is something wrong.....rather, he is asking why "Prince"??? Notice he never question why "Joseph" ??
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Originally posted by Shao Wei:
don't twist my meaning,
if he want to go and learn and research go ahead.im not advising him in ANYWAY to stop learning, searching the truth. he should.
i only find him NO NEED for him to explain to you, as you bunch of people already have a certain mindset.
why bother?
So no need for me to bother about you...
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Why "Prince"? This is my opinion.
We are kings and princes, children of the Most High God who is the King of kings, and Lord of Lords. "Prince" relate to royalty. He must be alluding to the faith that he being born again now has royal blood. Behold, the kingdom of Heaven. This is good name - reminds me that I am also a prince.
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Originally posted by GangstaGal:
Why "Prince"? This is my opinion.
We are kings and princes, children of the Most High God who is the King of kings, and Lord of Lords. "Prince" relate to royalty. He must be alluding to the faith that he being born again now has royal blood. Behold, the kingdom of Heaven. This is good name - reminds me that I am also a prince.
Jerry Prince
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Originally posted by Joolead:
then in the end you even poorer than now ..
after you give, the above statmenrt may prove true. dun deny it -
Originally posted by SPDCP:
He changed it for the same reason God changed Jacob's name to Israel.. There is nothing wrong with changing your name, do it if you want... Lots of people have done it for reasons i cant care to mention... why should it be surprising or rather, why is it even other peoples business what his name is?
You are right when you ask why it is other people's business what he changes his name to.
However, some things are not as clear cut especially when religion (in this case Christianity) is concerned.
You have seen in recent cases how the basic fundamental teachings of religion have been warped into self serving interests, so one has to be skeptical whenever something does not seem to conform to what that religion preaches or believes in.
I just feel that the name "Prince" is not suitable especially in the context of the christian faith since there is a connotation of royalty. Why not "James" or "John" or "Andrew"? Are these names too common so a religious leader needs to come up with a "special" name? Again, you need to see it in the context of the religion involved.
If anybody else who is not a religious leader calls himself "Prince", then I have no cause for concern.
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Originally posted by noahnoah:
it sounds nicersince u cant call urself King
so a bit lower,
call urself prince instead
As per my post above, some names may not be suitable especially if you look at it in the context of the religion involved.
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Rev 5:9 And [now] they sing a new song, saying, You are worthy to take the scroll and to break the seals that are on it, for You were slain (sacrificed), and with Your blood You purchased men unto God from every tribe and language and people and nation.
Rev 5:10 And You have made them a kingdom (royal race) and priests to our God, and they shall reign [as kings] over the earth!
God's children Are Called To Be a KING And a PRIEST
so what is wrong to name oneself as Prince ?
There are some who named themselves as Pastor King xxxxx
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Yea but bragging about being king while they are not yet is not wise.
And not all would be king to rule with Christ the majority will not receive eternal power only eternal life. -
Originally posted by Miracles&Prophecies:
Yea but bragging about being king while they are not yet is not wise.
And not all would be king to rule with Christ the majority will not receive eternal power only eternal life.I agree with you. Jesus need not call Himself King or Prince.........
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Originally posted by ProdigalSon:
Rev 5:9 And [now] they sing a new song, saying, You are worthy to take the scroll and to break the seals that are on it, for You were slain (sacrificed), and with Your blood You purchased men unto God from every tribe and language and people and nation.
Rev 5:10 And You have made them a kingdom (royal race) and priests to our God, and they shall reign [as kings] over the earth!
God's children Are Called To Be a KING And a PRIEST
so what is wrong to name oneself as Prince ?
There are some who named themselves as Pastor King xxxxx
It's the connotation of the name.
You need to see it in the context of the religion.
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Originally posted by ProdigalSon:
Rev 5:10 And You have made them a kingdom (royal race) and priests to our God, and they shall reign [as kings] over the earth!
God's children Are Called To Be a KING And a PRIEST
so what is wrong to name oneself as Prince ?
so many kings, no subjects....there are too many metaphors in Revelations...
it's ok if one is born with the name or surname "prince" but it's another thing to lift oneself to a position of "glory"...
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Originally posted by Chin Eng:
so many kings, no subjects....there are too many metaphors in Revelations...
it's ok if one is born with the name or surname "prince" but it's another thing to lift oneself to a position of "glory"...
The kings who rule with Christ is not a metaphor. Some people will really rule with Christ. They shall reign as kings.....
And they shall....the passage is a prophecy not yet fulfilled. Because Christ hasn't returned. In fact according to the bible the dead is not yet risen. And Christ coming is the time for those who would rule with Him be raised. The rest will only be raised at the end of time or the time of judgment. -
It's sad to believe in God without eventually knowing God.
I don't mean you I mean so many people are like that. -
Originally posted by Miracles&Prophecies:
The kings who rule with Christ is not a metaphor. Some people will really rule with Christ. They shall reign as kings.....
And they shall....the passage is a prophecy not yet fulfilled. Because Christ hasn't returned. In fact according to the bible the dead is not yet risen. And Christ coming is the time for those who would rule with Him be raised. The rest will only be raised at the end of time or the time of judgment.i stand by my opinion that Revelations is a metaphorical book. the languages and imagery used is not to be taken literally. throughout the ages, this book had stumped many theologians and scholars on what it really means....
but at the end of the day, you are also entitled to your opinion.....
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Originally posted by Chin Eng:
i stand by my opinion that Revelations is a metaphorical book. the languages and imagery used is not to be taken literally. throughout the ages, this book had stumped many theologians and scholars on what it really means....
but at the end of the day, you are also entitled to your opinion.....
Yes revelation contains many metaphor but let's just say I know that men could be higher than the angels of God. I know it's the greatest thing one could ever hope to happen to him. I never wanted be like anyone else..really...but..
Part of the the argument about greatness
Luke 22:28-29
You have stayed with me in all my troubles. So I will give you the right to rule as kings, just as my Father has given me the right to rule as a king. You will eat and drink with me in my kingdom, and you will each sit on a throne to judge the 12 tribes of Israel.
And if you thought what subjects then everything everything. Power from God is not power of the kingdom of man. The fulfillment of Kingdom of God is yet to come.
And you too are entitled to your own opinion :-D -
Originally posted by Miracles&Prophecies:
Yes revelation contains many metaphor but let's just say I know that men could be higher than the angels of God. I know it's the greatest thing one could ever hope to happen to him. I never wanted be like anyone else..really...but..
Part of the the argument about greatness
Luke 22:28-29
You have stayed with me in all my troubles. So I will give you the right to rule as kings, just as my Father has given me the right to rule as a king. You will eat and drink with me in my kingdom, and you will each sit on a throne to judge the 12 tribes of Israel.
And if you thought what subjects then everything everything. Power from God is not power of the kingdom of man. The fulfillment of Kingdom of God is yet to come.
And you too are entitled to your own opinion :-D... but note what precedes verse 28...
24Also a dispute arose among them as to which of them was considered to be greatest. 25Jesus said to them, "The kings of the Gentiles lord it over them; and those who exercise authority over them call themselves Benefactors. 26But you are not to be like that. Instead, the greatest among you should be like the youngest, and the one who rules like the one who serves. 27For who is greater, the one who is at the table or the one who serves? Is it not the one who is at the table? But I am among you as one who serves. 28You are those who have stood by me in my trials. 29And I confer on you a kingdom, just as my Father conferred one on me, 30so that you may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom and sit on thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
... so who is greater, the one who is at the table or the one who serves?
... at the end of the day, let's not get hung out on whether we will be kings or not, but rather, whether we can be servants where we are today.
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Originally posted by Chin Eng:
... but note what precedes verse 28...
24Also a dispute arose among them as to which of them was considered to be greatest. 25Jesus said to them, "The kings of the Gentiles lord it over them; and those who exercise authority over them call themselves Benefactors. 26But you are not to be like that. Instead, the greatest among you should be like the youngest, and the one who rules like the one who serves. 27For who is greater, the one who is at the table or the one who serves? Is it not the one who is at the table? But I am among you as one who serves. 28You are those who have stood by me in my trials. 29And I confer on you a kingdom, just as my Father conferred one on me, 30so that you may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom and sit on thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
... so who is greater, the one who is at the table or the one who serves?
... at the end of the day, let's not get hung out on whether we will be kings or not, but rather, whether we can be servants where we are today.
Chien Eng you're mistaking ruling in the next world with ruling in this world. I wasn't talking about being king as man.