In the Bible , it recorded tat
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no .. we won't flame you.Originally posted by noahnoah:If is say anything wrong here
Please dun flame me
we wait for fireballs to drop from the sky.
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I dun think i will die in such a horrible death..Originally posted by Icemoon:no .. we won't flame you.
we wait for fireballs to drop from the sky.
But if thats is going to be God 's will
bo bian also -
no fireball one lah... not area target what... just need precision strike de..Originally posted by Icemoon:no .. we won't flame you.
we wait for fireballs to drop from the sky. -
ask yourself this, is that a norm or an isolated incident?Originally posted by noahnoah:Read on Acts chp 5
if its a norm, Saul (aka Paul) should be dead for killing christians
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Bad example.Originally posted by vince69:ask yourself this, is that a norm or an isolated incident?
if its a norm, Saul (aka Paul) should be dead for killing christians
Saul killed christians before he became Paul. Since when are your sins before your conversion accountable? -
Frankly speaking ....
Whers is god love when he strike the many people dead ?
I dun think God will strike anyone to death Now
because God Love is flowing like a River non stop
As he is our potter , i think he rather mould our character
then to strike us down
Cannot tahan God
He too loving , graceful and always there to correct one's fault
U forgot Noah, sodom, midianites and a lot of other incidents where he strike the whole community to death instead of "moulding their character". Is tat your idea of love and gracefulness ? -
then those examples from OT all cannot count also, right? none of them went through conversion also...Originally posted by Icemoon:Bad example.
Saul killed christians before he became Paul. Since when are your sins before your conversion accountable?
my question still remains, the Acts 5 incident, is that a one off unique case or is it a norm?
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Qiang ci duo li.Originally posted by vince69:then those examples from OT all cannot count also, right? none of them went through conversion also...
my question still remains, the Acts 5 incident, is that a one off unique case or is it a norm?
Since when do Jews need conversion? Oxymoron.
Edit: Jews can only opt out, not opt in. For example, the Jews during the time of Jesus accused the Samaritans of opting out. The latter were descendants of the 12 tribes also. -
How do we even know whether it is a norm?Originally posted by vince69:my question still remains, the Acts 5 incident, is that a one off unique case or is it a norm?
Maybe the Apostles killed many other Christians as well, but those were not recorded. -
and Saul is a JewOriginally posted by Icemoon:Qiang ci duo li.
Since when do Jews need conversion? Oxymoron.
Edit: Jews can only opt out, not opt in. For example, the Jews during the time of Jesus accused the Samaritans of opting out. The latter were descendants of the 12 tribes also. a pharisee somemore (or at least one in training)
side track a bit, the Samaritians opt out or were they kicked out?
I do remember reading it somewhere, that they were kicked out, something to do with them and mixed marriages with non Jewish inhabitants. -
It was not possible to save the innocent without taking the lives of the guilty ones.Originally posted by stupidissmart:Whers is god love when he strike the many people dead ? U forgot Noah, sodom, midianites and a lot of other incidents where he strike the whole community to death instead of "moulding their character". Is tat your idea of love and gracefulness ? -
That is the problem, are we reading it from the OT perspective or NT perspective?Originally posted by vince69:and Saul is a Jew a pharisee somemore (or at least one in training)
side track a bit, the Samaritians opt out or were they kicked out?
I do remember reading it somewhere, that they were kicked out, something to do with them and mixed marriages with non Jewish inhabitants.
If we are dealing with the Hebrew Bible, then there is no conversion, only opting out.
If we are dealing with the Christian Bible, there is conversion and opting out. To be a Christian, you have to be converted. In the Apostle Paul's own words, you have to die and resurrect with the Lord Jesus.
The Samaritans opted out and was kicked out, from the Jewish perspective.
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Am I confusing?
Edit: What I mean essentially is, the audience of the Hebrew Bible are the Israelites, these people need not convert and they can opt out; the audience of the Christian Bible are the Christians, conversion is significant for them.
For the Jewish apostles, they were very much different before and after conversion. -
It was not possible to save the innocent without taking the lives of the guilty ones
Isn't god omnipotent ? How can god be restricted by situation ? -
few things...Originally posted by Icemoon:Am I confusing?
Edit: What I mean essentially is, the audience of the Hebrew Bible are the Israelites, these people need not convert and they can opt out; the audience of the Christian Bible are the Christians, conversion is significant for them.
For the Jewish apostles, they were very much different before and after conversion.
not all whose kena strike dead in OT are Jews, the 12 tribes comes from Jacob, so those before Jacob (aka Israel) are definitely not Jews. so no such thng as opt in or opt out.
the subject says... In the Bible (both OT and NT are included)... it is recorded that (means found recorded in the Bible)...
hence those that the Apostles may have killed but not recorded, well... cannot count also.
Hence before Christ, it may be happening often, but after that, the Acts 5 incident became more a unique case rather then the norm.
want to scold, go scold the thread starter, not specific enough with the subject, anyhow float all over the place...
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God is omnipotent for sure.Originally posted by stupidissmart:Isn't god omnipotent ? How can god be restricted by situation ?
In my opinion, He was not restricted by the situation but by His character. His intolerance for sin is one of them. However, in Sodom and Gomorrah, He did allow Abram to plead for the innocent. The unrighteous must be punished, while the righteous He will save. -
If you want to be technical, your definition already wrong liao. Jews are from the tribe of Judah lah.Originally posted by vince69:few things...
not all whose kena strike dead in OT are Jews, the 12 tribes comes from Jacob, so those before Jacob (aka Israel) are definitely not Jews. so no such thng as opt in or opt out.
the subject says... In the Bible (both OT and NT are included)... it is recorded that (means found recorded in the Bible)...
hence those that the Apostles may have killed but not recorded, well... cannot count also.
Hence before Christ, it may be happening often, but after that, the Acts 5 incident became more a unique case rather then the norm.
want to scold, go scold the thread starter, not specific enough with the subject, anyhow float all over the place...
Of course God also killed non descendants of Jacob in the OT, but the discussion is about believers of God, the audience of the OT or NT right?
Edit: The thing is, if you are a believer, you are expected to obey God. If you are not a believer, you heck care got God or not?
The subject says in the bible, yes, or what else you expect?
Don't only read the subject. Read the elaboration as well. -
says who? to man it may be impossible, to God everything are possible.Originally posted by sillyme:It was not possible to save the innocent without taking the lives of the guilty ones. -
wah .. finally you and SIS agree on something!Originally posted by vince69:says who? to man it may be impossible, to God everything are possible. -
God is omnipotent for sure.
Then where is the love ? I find tat killing someone because they do not fit your standard is not love. A person's son is stupid and fail his tests consistently. So the father can kill him ? Furthermore he is an omnipotent god. If I am omnipotent and can get anything I want, I will not sin too.
In my opinion, He was not restricted by the situation but by His character. His intolerance for sin is one of them. However, in Sodom and Gomorrah, He did allow Abram to plead for the innocent. The unrighteous must be punished, while the righteous He will save. -
you sure? (anyway, Judah also sin of Jacob, so notion still stand, those before Jacob definitely not Jews)Originally posted by Icemoon:If you want to be technical, your definition already wrong liao. Jews are from the tribe of Judah lah.
Of course God also killed non descendants of Jacob in the OT, but the discussion is about believers of God, the audience of the OT or NT right?
Edit: The thing is, if you are a believer, you are expected to obey God. If you are not a believer, you heck care got God or not?
The subject says in the bible, yes, or what else you expect?
Don't only read the subject. Read the elaboration as well.
Levites are not from Judah,
anyway... way off topic liao...
YES, as believers, one is expected to obey God.
My question still is, what happen to teh husband&wife in Acts 5, as in the Bible, is there a repetition? if no, then is that a norm? or a single unique act? -
Then you need to explain why God killed some and saved the rest lorOriginally posted by vince69:says who? to man it may be impossible, to God everything are possible. 
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I think it is not about fitting a standard. It's about having the right perspective about your relationship with God and with the people around you. To be sinless, is to have a right relationship with God.Originally posted by stupidissmart:Then where is the love ? I find tat killing someone because they do not fit your standard is not love. A person's son is stupid and fail his tests consistently. So the father can kill him ? Furthermore he is an omnipotent god. If I am omnipotent and can get anything I want, I will not sin too.
If you do not believe that you are created by God, and that He has a right to your life, then everything will be unfair and everything God does can be considered "evil". -
Like I said, we are not sure whether it is a norm or not. If it is a norm, then quite worrying isn't it?Originally posted by vince69:YES, as believers, one is expected to obey God.
My question still is, what happen to teh husband&wife in Acts 5, as in the Bible, is there a repetition? if no, then is that a norm? or a single unique act?
Btw, Jews were from the Kingdom of Judah, my mistake. Basically those Israelites who never opted out, mostly from Judah and Levi. -
Are you a priest?? Seems like you trying to convert or recruit people.........