Is Circumcision A Must?
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Someone forward me this question. And with the following passage.
Genesis 17:10
This is my covenant, which ye shall keep, between me and you and thy seed after thee; Every man child among you shall be circumcised.
Galatians 5:2-3
Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.
He said there is contradictions.
And I argued with him like this. I told him that since Christ has not revealed himself yet, the only way we can offer ourself to God is through part of our body.
And then in
Hebrews 9:22
And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
So that means, since circumcision is bloody, it is now void and thats why baptism took precedence.
Can I say like that? Correct or not? -
for YOU, is a must. better yet, try a glansectomy
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I thought castration is the best for campy?
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Why don't you ask the Jews whether circumcision is a must?Originally posted by mhcampboy:Someone forward me this question. And with the following passage.
Genesis 17:10
This is my covenant, which ye shall keep, between me and you and thy seed after thee; Every man child among you shall be circumcised.
Of course not! You are neither Abraham nor his descendant. -
In Romans 2:17-29, Paul speaks of the circumcision of the heart. Physical circumcision is not practised among Christians.
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Campy should be emasculated.
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ermm.. tats not my question...Originally posted by Icemoon:Why don't you ask the Jews whether circumcision is a must?
Of course not! You are neither Abraham nor his descendant.
my question was whether i could reply to my friend like the above.. -
isn't your question "is circumcision a must"?Originally posted by mhcampboy:ermm.. tats not my question...
my question was whether i could reply to my friend like the above..
edit: sorry, I realized your topic is misleading. -
u only read the question... and not the post ar?Originally posted by Icemoon:isn't your question "is circumcision a must"? -
Maybe you can help by providing more details about his question, or what you want to find out.
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no la... he gave me the above 2 quotes from the bible...Originally posted by sillyme:Maybe you can help by providing more details about his question, or what you want to find out.
then i explain to him as above...
just wanna know... am i rite by explaining it tat way? -
Do you know the context in which those two verses were recorded?Originally posted by mhcampboy:no la... he gave me the above 2 quotes from the bible...
then i explain to him as above...
just wanna know... am i rite by explaining it tat way?
ie: which group of people were being addressed to: for Genesis and for Galatians?
the worst way to read the Bible is to take one obscure verse and attached a meaning to it. totally disregarding the intention, the audience, and the setting in which these verses were written. -
Originally posted by Chin Eng:
And I argued with him like this. I told him that since Christ has not revealed himself yet, the only way we can offer ourself to God is through part of our body.
Do you know the context in which those two verses were recorded?
ie: which group of people were being addressed to: for Genesis and for Galatians?
[b]the worst way to read the Bible is to take one obscure verse and attached a meaning to it.[/b]
And then in
Hebrews 9:22
And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
So that means, since circumcision is bloody, it is now void and thats why baptism took precedence.
Can I say like that? Correct or not? -
Personally, I don't agree with your rationale.Originally posted by mhcampboy:And I argued with him like this. I told him that since Christ has not revealed himself yet, the only way we can offer ourself to God is through part of our body.
And then in
Hebrews 9:22
And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
So that means, since circumcision is bloody, it is now void and thats why baptism took precedence.
Can I say like that? Correct or not?
All I am saying is that the friend who quoted all those verses to you (like many people who anyhow read the Bible) just took something out of context and anyhow whack.
Verses must be quoted with responsibility. This responsibility includes know why such verses are written, to whom it is written to, and for what they are written.
It is very easy to lift up some text to support one's stand, it is more difficult to take an entire passage to do the same. -
Actually, rereading the starting thread I am kinda confused!
Is your friend point out the contradictions, or is your friend supporting circumcision? -
contradictions.
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hmmm... what kind of contradictions? As CE pointed out, the two verses were addressing two different audience.
One happened before God's salvation of mankind through Christ. Having redeemed through Christ, the emphasis is on circumcision of the heart, i.e. we are called to be live holy lives.
I don't think it has to do with purging with blood. -
as I'd said, taking one verse out of a very very long passage can put anything out of context.Originally posted by mhcampboy:contradictions.
say, if I am to say to you: let's get out and have a good meal at a buffet, eat anything you want, and have a good time.
and I say to another: the buffet is not good for you because of your cardiac problem, you should avoid it because it's going to clog up you arteries....
do I contradict myself because on one hand, i say the buffet is good in on the other, i say that the buffet is bad?
context....my friend, context.... -
Castrations!Originally posted by mhcampboy:contradictions.
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Baptism is the new circumsision.
In him you were also circumcised with a circumcision not administered by hand, by stripping off the carnal body, with the circumcision of Christ. You were buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead.
Col 2:10-11This prefigured baptism, which saves you now. It is not a removal of dirt from the body but an appeal to God 7 for a clear conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ.
The phrase "not as a removal of dirt from the body" is in referecne to the Jewish ceremony of circumcision. Baptism is now the “circumcision” of the new Covenant (Col. 2:11-12), but it, unlike the old circumcision, actually saves us, as Noah and his family were saved by water.
1 Peter 3:21
Church Fathers:
"We are circumcised not with a fleshly circumcision but with the circumcision of Christ, that is, we are born again into a new man; for, being buried with Him in His baptism, we must die to the old man, because the regeneration of baptism has the force of resurrection." Hilary of Poitiers, Trinity, 9:9 (A.D. 359).
"But in respect of the case of the infants, which you say ought not to be baptized within the second or third day after their birth, and that the law of ancient circumcision should be regarded, so that you think one who is just born should not be baptized and sanctified within the eighth day...And therefore, dearest brother, this was our opinion in council, that by us no one ought to be hindered from baptism...we think is to be even more observed in respect of infants and newly-born personsÂ…" Cyprian, To Fidus, Epistle 58(64):2, 6 (A.D. 251).