The Scientists' View
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tell him he's gonna learn nuclear physics in secondary school.Originally posted by Chin Eng:my 11 yr old just asked me how is the atomic bomb created... I stared and say, I dunno! check wikipedia lah. Not sure if he's planning something... gotta watch out...
while learning about atomic bomb, good time to bring in the ethics part. like how the various team members (in the Manhattan Project) felt after the bomb was detonated. -
We shall term this scandal "the EH gate" scandal.Originally posted by Icemoon:tell him he's gonna learn nuclear physics in secondary school.
while learning about atomic bomb, good time to bring in the ethics part. like how the various team members (in the Manhattan Project) felt after the bomb was detonated. -
we got scandal meh?
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what scandal???Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:We shall term this scandal "the EH gate" scandal. 
sandal you want or not? -
You think machiam like selling wife meh?(Book of Ruth)Originally posted by Chin Eng:what scandal??? sandal you want or not? -
Since we have established that, we can all move on.Originally posted by Chin Eng:your other points... I don't really want to answer already. I have said enough already.
This one, I want to:
Why isn't it closed?
1. I was not a mod then, so I cannot close it, the last post was in October. But the main reason is:
[b]2. This is a Christian forum. If say, someone declares that Jesus is Lord and saviour and I did not close it, it is perfectly normal to, say, someone else posting Jesus is a fraud.... and I look it up go figure.... am I bias here? Entirely up to you.
3. Sure, we are mods and you are not ... knock yourself out... start your own forum. There apparently already is one by the atheist... you don't see me going in there and write what I believe do you? Maybe you should start one for the scientific community. Seriously, I am not even trying to be sarcastic, I mean it from the bottom of my heart.
I take it that you are peeved because your first thread was closed.... I kept this one open, so I guess we are even.
And BTW, again I remind you, this is a Christian forum, like it or not. If the posts here are bias towards Christianity, you think it is unfair. If you don't like what you read, too bad.
I want to stress: we do not oppose questions opposing Christianity - just don't start with "are you guys delusional or something?". The other non-Christians also understand this, can you!?[/b][/quote]
Fair enough.
[quote]Originally posted by sillyme:
Just to clarify. The thread referenced as a flame bait. I was MIA during that time and CE was not the moderator at that time. I only reappeared recently.
So some parts of evolution can be established. Now what?
I believe it's a fair statement too. But even more so than creationism one day emerging as the dominant theory for our existence, I believe more evidence supporting evolution will be found in the future that strengthens its validity.Originally posted by Chin Eng: this is quite funny... the presumption, I mean....
I happen to be one of the few Christians that support evolution (up to a point).
Your link: http://books.nap.edu/html/creationism/introduction.html
Fact: In science, an observation that has been repeatedly confirmed and for all practical purposes is accepted as "true." Truth in science, however, is never final, and what is accepted as a fact today may be modified or even discarded tomorrow.
Therefore it can be safely concluded that truth in science is never final. I think this is a fair statement. -
and that is entirely up to you, but please do not call other people who do believe in creationism delusional... so this was the entire purpose of your starting the thread??? what purpose has it achieved????Originally posted by pretzel:I believe it's a fair statement too. But even more so than creationism one day emerging as the dominant theory for our existence, I believe more evidence supporting evolution will be found in the future that strengthens its validity.
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3 pages of crap...Originally posted by breytonhartge:what purpose has it achieved???? just kidding.... -
I do not believe that pure creationsim will one day be the dominant theory for our existence.Originally posted by pretzel:I believe it's a fair statement too. But even more so than creationism one day emerging as the dominant theory for our existence, I believe more evidence supporting evolution will be found in the future that strengthens its validity. -
Originally posted by Chin Eng:3 pages of crap... just kidding....
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Actually they are delusional now.Originally posted by breytonhartge:and that is entirely up to you, but please do not call other people who do believe in creationism delusional... so this was the entire purpose of your starting the thread??? what purpose has it achieved????
Only when there is a 180 degrees paradigm shift in future, these delulsional people will be vindicated.
Until then, they are delusional. -
Pure creationism denies almost all related disciplines in Science. It is not evolution that is at stake here, but astronomy, geology, paleontology, thermodynamics and many more.Originally posted by Chin Eng:I do not believe that pure creationsim will one day be the dominant theory for our existence.
It will make God the author of confusion. -
Anyway, back to topic, how do you guys explain the validity of the concepts in science like evolution and the Big Bang to developing christians who are in secondary schools?Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:You think machiam like selling wife meh?(Book of Ruth)
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that's easy.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:Anyway, back to topic, how do you guys explain the validity of the concepts in science like evolution and the Big Bang to developing christians who are in secondary schools?
ask the students .. WHY do you think they are not valid?
Engage them. No use shoving people creationist tracts or Dawkin's books. -
How about planning experiments to show which is true?Originally posted by Icemoon:that's easy.
ask the students .. WHY do you think they are not valid?
Engage them. No use shoving people creationist tracts or Dawkin's books. -
erm .. for evolution and big bang?Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:How about planning experiments to show which is true?
don't think so bah. -
Personally, I really have no problem with schools teaching such concepts.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:Anyway, back to topic, how do you guys explain the validity of the concepts in science like evolution and the Big Bang to developing christians who are in secondary schools?
Just a week ago, my older son mentioned that his science teacher discussed the Big Bang theory in class.... immediately, I exclaimed... "oorrrhhh! cannot!" and followed by a huge laughing session between two of us.
Seriously, the school can teach whatever they want. My family philosophy is: the mentoring and educating of the child primarily falls on the shoulder of the parents, so myself? I don't really care if schools teach evolution, or big bang or whatever. At the end of the day, I do not think that either one side is totally right in their interpretation. If I have to make a decision, I'd think the truth is drawn some where in the middle of creationism and evolution. Evolution gives me an insight as to HOW the world can be created. Creationism (in the Christian POV) tells me the WHY. -
Frankly, there isn't any cure for stupidity. Let me have the honour:Originally posted by breytonhartge:and that is entirely up to you, but please do not call other people who do believe in creationism delusional... so this was the entire purpose of your starting the thread??? what purpose has it achieved????
http://www.aapt.org/Policy/evolutandcosmo.cfmOriginally posted by breytonhartge:evolution has still to be proven to be scientific fact...
http://www.agiweb.org/gap/legis107/evolutionletter.html
http://www.aaanet.org/stmts/evolution.htm
http://www.emast.org/content/index.cfm/ContentID/577/SectionID/75
http://www2.ncseweb.org/wp/?page_id=108
http://www.nabt.org/sites/S1/index.php?p=65
http://www.statweb.org/positions/STATEvolution.html
http://www.nsta.org/159&psid=10
http://www.interacademies.net/Object.File/Master/6/150/Evolution%20statement.pdf
http://www.nap.edu/html/creationism/introduction.html
http://www.aaas.org/news/releases/2006/pdf/0219boardstatement.pdf -
There you go again.Originally posted by pretzel:Frankly, there isn't any cure for stupidity. Let me have the honour:
The people here have so far respected your right not to believe in any religion, be it Christianity or any other faith, your not believing there is a God is a belief in itself.
Just as how others have respected your beliefs, it would be nice for you to respect the belief of others. Questions are one thing, but when you are tending towards provoking and annoying people by the tone and nature of your posts, its a different thing altogether.
I seriously doubt the "good intentions" of your posts. And I can tell you that this discussion is going to end up nowhere, because ultimately everyone will still continue to believe in what they originally believed in.
And with people like you posting remarks like that, it's no wonder that eventually such threads become flame baits. Which I think might be your intention all along. But it remains to be seen if your behaviour would improve.
Post your questions and queries, but leave out the snide remarks and the insults. The people here in general have been very gracious in replying your points despite your annoying and bratty behaviour. As a person being, you should be gracious enough to do the same.
Unless your intention is to just stir up trouble, then it's a different thing altogether. -
To the mod or whoever has the authority.
I would suggest that if Mr/Ms Pretzel does not improve his or her manner of posting, we should just close the thread and stop the discussion altogether. Afterall, sillyme has already told him to be nice.
If even after being told so, and pretzel still choose not to engage discussions politely and nicely, then I think we should just stop entertaining him, since he is not willing to be as gracious to others as how others are to him.
This isn't about religion or anything. It's more about basic courtest which Pretzel seems to lack. -
And if they both offer discordant views?Originally posted by Chin Eng:Personally, I really have no problem with schools teaching such concepts.
Just a week ago, my older son mentioned that his science teacher discussed the Big Bang theory in class.... immediately, I exclaimed... "oorrrhhh! cannot!" and followed by a huge laughing session between two of us.
Seriously, the school can teach whatever they want. My family philosophy is: the mentoring and educating of the child primarily falls on the shoulder of the parents, so myself? I don't really care if schools teach evolution, or big bang or whatever. At the end of the day, I do not think that either one side is totally right in their interpretation. If I have to make a decision, I'd think the truth is drawn some where in the middle of creationism and evolution. Evolution gives me an insight as to HOW the world can be created. Creationism (in the Christian POV) tells me the WHY. -
Even beyond religion or faith, there will always be discordant views. As you are probably aware, I am a very hands-on parent, and I am very interested in the view of what the teachers (or school) take.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:And if they both offer discordant views?
To me, home-mentoring is more important to what they teach in school. So if there are issues to be "corrected", I will do it. However, all said and done, I have also instilled the sense of personal opinion to my children, ie, they are entitled to their personal interpretations and opinions. -
I will leave this thread open for a bit more. If the exchange continues to be confrontation and accusatory, I will close it..... unless my boss beats me to it....
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Every child's dream parent, even young satanists don't mind this kind of parent.Originally posted by Chin Eng:Even beyond religion or faith, there will always be discordant views. As you are probably aware, I am a very hands-on parent, and I am very interested in the view of what the teachers (or school) take.
To me, home-mentoring is more important to what they teach in school. So if there are issues to be "corrected", I will do it. However, all said and done, I have also instilled the sense of personal opinion to my children, ie, they are entitled to their personal interpretations and opinions. -
Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:Every child's dream parent, even young satanists don't mind this kind of parent. I can safely say that my boys will not grow to be satanist... just very open minded Christians, like their dad.