Some questions...
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I have some questions about christianity which I would like to know. Hope people here would be able to answer me! Thanks
1) How do you guys know whether the things written in the bible is correct? Especially when you all claim that it is written more then 2000 years ago?
2) Where did the world come from? God created it? So who created god? And who created the one who created god?
3) Why is it that people who doesn't believe in Christianity will go to hell? Is there even such a place? So those infants who died will go to hell immediately, since they are not even able to think and choose what religions to believe in?
4) I think that Christianity is just one of the many religions in the world, so why do Christians have to say that the other religions are not real whereas theirs are? Isn't that an insult to the other religions? -
I will try, on the assumption that this is not a flame-bait.
There are many ways to look at this. The most common one for Christians and the one least acceptable to non-Christians, I think, is by faith. Therefore, I will not use this as a reason. When we look at the culture written about those periods, there have been cities, such as Ur of the Chaldees (where Abraham was said to have come from) that was not presumed to have existed. Archaelogical evidence have discovered that there is sucha place. So if all other issues are unacceptable to non-Christians, at least the historical part has been proven. Note, too, that most documentaries produced by non-Christians do not actually doubt the "HISTORY" of the Biblical stories, only the "DIVINITY" of the stories.Originally posted by technoboy:1) How do you guys know whether the things written in the bible is correct? Especially when you all claim that it is written more then 2000 years ago?
Again, the question is directed to the Christian world view: yes, God created the world. There have been some theories that perhaps, Earth is NOT the only world the God has created (but such theories do not affect the theology that is of this world). Who created God? The Bible said that God was never created. God existed from the beginning..... but this kind of question goes round and round, and unless one accept that God existed from the beginning, no one has the answer.Originally posted by technoboy:2) Where did the world come from? God created it? So who created god? And who created the one who created god?
Again another question to the Christian worldview.... What is hell? Is it the opposite of heaven? Or is hell a place that bad people go. Note also that theOriginally posted by technoboy:3) Why is it that people who doesn't believe in Christianity will go to hell? Is there even such a place? So those infants who died will go to hell immediately, since they are not even able to think and choose what religions to believe in?
"hell concept" is not exclusive to the Christian faith. Most other faith has such a place. It might be a place, or it might be a vivid description of the destruction of the soul, eternally.
Realistically, there are only two ways to this:Originally posted by technoboy:4) I think that Christianity is just one of the many religions in the world, so why do Christians have to say that the other religions are not real whereas theirs are? Isn't that an insult to the other religions?
1. Worship whoever you want, because all religion leads to the same God.
2. Pick "MY" religion, because it's the only one that will bring you to the truth.
Each religion will fall into one of the above categories.
Yup, I have heard even pastors preaching that other religions are not real etc etc. From the theological stand point, it's in accordance with Biblical teachings. However, as an individual, would I SAY it out: probably not, because, as you had said, it is quite insulting (but this is a personal conviction), no different from, say, I think you are ugly, but I won't say it to you in the face. -
Let me have a shot and I will try to supplement parts which Chin Eng have missed out.
The bible is unique among all the religious scriptures because it is falsifiable. Christianity was born because of one historical event - the death and resurrection of Christ Jesus. Most academics believe He existed, the question is whether the event really happened and His divinity. And since Jesus quoted from the Old Testament, it is implicit that they are correct too.Originally posted by technoboy:1) How do you guys know whether the things written in the bible is correct? Especially when you all claim that it is written more then 2000 years ago?
Chin Eng is right that archaeology and history can be used to tackle the question, but I think the approach is ultimately a weak one, since you can "verify" other faiths like Judaism and Islam the same way.
So I guess the best answer to a non-Christian is, we dunno. If you understand how the bible came into being, then you know how tricky is the whole issue ..2) Where did the world come from? God created it? So who created god? And who created the one who created god?
In theology, God is the uncaused Cause. So naturally nothing created God.
In biblical language, God has existed since "the beginning" (c.f. John 1:1 - In the beginning was the Word, the Word was with God and the Word was God.)3) Why is it that people who doesn't believe in Christianity will go to hell? Is there even such a place? So those infants who died will go to hell immediately, since they are not even able to think and choose what religions to believe in?
Chin Eng did not actually answer your question.
To answer your question, we should not focus on hell first, but the Christian view of SIN. This is a long topic but the the summary is that we are all sinners in one way or another and only Christ Jesus can justify you in front of God. God is perfect, He can't stand sin, so in order to go heaven (it is either up or down for every of us), you must be sinless.
Regarding infants, there are indeed Christians who believe that they will not go to hell. This is an accepted belief among orthodox Christian, meaning it is not a heresy.4) I think that Christianity is just one of the many religions in the world, so why do Christians have to say that the other religions are not real whereas theirs are? Isn't that an insult to the other religions?[/
Actually it is not as bad as you think, just that many Christians do not see the big picture.
If they say other religions are not real, an analogy will be this - 'chiong' Prada bags. Christianity is the authentic Prada bag, whereas others are counterfeits to varying degrees. So maybe one religion is 'A' Goods (if your religion has a god) but another one is straight fake (if you have many many idols).
But I think the real picture could be this - Christianity is the authentic Prada bag, with the real Prada certificate of worksmanship, but others are either early defects (and Prada disposed them early during the manufacturing process, only to be found by other craftsmen) or that some clever craftsman stole the design from Prada and built their own imitation.
I think most of us agree that there are many religions but some are more real than others. For example Buddhism vs. Shamanism. The Old Testament has harsh criticisms for other religions like the worship of Baal and Asherah but it could be that they were distracting the Hebrews from worship of the true God YHWH (God for the Jews and Christians).
If you fast forward to the New Testament Book of Acts Chapter 17, you find a totally different story from the relentless OT condemnation of other religions.
22 Paul then stood up in the meeting of the Areopagus and said: "People of Athens! I see that in every way you are very religious. 23 For as I walked around and looked carefully at your objects of worship, I even found an altar with this inscription: TO AN UNKNOWN GOD. So you are ignorant of the very thing you worship—and this is what I am going to proclaim to you.
There was no condemnation!!
(I actually learn this unknown god in the Catholic catechism class .. I guess Protestants will never tell me that. ) -
In case I was not very clear ..
The Hebrews were condemned because they knew the true God but still worshipped other Gods.
The Greeks worshipping the unknown god were not condemned, instead Paul nicely guided them to God.
Put it in modern perspective, which category do you think other religious followers fall into? -
Originally posted by technoboy:
I think you already have the answer for your question in your question.
2) Where did the world come from? God created it? So who created god? And who created the one who created god?
b]
The reason is this. God is a creator as all of you know. Then if he is the creator can he be created? Then the person who created him must be God.
Right?
So naturally, God isnt created.
And naturally, God isnt created by humans. -
4) I think that Christianity is just one of the many religions in the world, so why do Christians have to say that the other religions are not real whereas theirs are? Isn't that an insult to the other religions?
Now the reason for this, you have to understand, is that truth is absolute. Truth itself is intolerant of non-truths.
Which means that if this is the truth, others are not the truth.
Relatively, if other is also the truth, then this is not the truth.
to add on, it has to oppose other theorys if it is the truth. -
I heard from Nat Geo that the Bible is actually written 100 years after Christians beileve that Jesus was crucified... So what is your view about the chances that his words were distorted in the 100 years of verbal teachings?Originally posted by Chin Eng:There are many ways to look at this. The most common one for Christians and the one least acceptable to non-Christians, I think, is by faith. Therefore, I will not use this as a reason. When we look at the culture written about those periods, there have been cities, such as Ur of the Chaldees (where Abraham was said to have come from) that was not presumed to have existed. Archaelogical evidence have discovered that there is sucha place. So if all other issues are unacceptable to non-Christians, at least the historical part has been proven. Note, too, that most documentaries produced by non-Christians do not actually doubt the "HISTORY" of the Biblical stories, only the "DIVINITY" of the stories. -
No lah .. not so bad .. where got 100 years?Originally posted by MohamedF:I heard from Nat Geo that the Bible is actually written 100 years after Christians beileve that Jesus was crucified... So what is your view about the chances that his words were distorted in the 100 years of verbal teachings?
The earliest was written decades after Christ, before the Jewish Revolt. -
No good .. go and brush up your rhetorical skills.Originally posted by davidche:I think you already have the answer for your question in your question.
The reason is this. God is a creator as all of you know. Then if he is the creator can he be created? Then the person who created him must be God.
Right?
So naturally, God isnt created.
And naturally, God isnt created by humans.
God as a creator only pertains to the world (heavens and the earth) and the heavenly realms. Therefore, it is possible God created Christ and let Christ do all the saikang creation.
So Christ is still creator of everything, but he himself is created by someone higher than him. -
are you sure?Originally posted by Icemoon:No good .. go and brush up your rhetorical skills.
God as a creator only pertains to the world (heavens and the earth) and the heavenly realms. Therefore, it is possible God created Christ and let Christ do all the saikang creation.
So Christ is still creator of everything, but he himself is created by someone higher than him.
but thought tat shld be under trinity?
3 for one, one for three -
I mean your rhetorical skill is poor not your theology is poor.Originally posted by davidche:are you sure?
but thought tat shld be under trinity?
3 for one, one for three
When you explain, must attempt to convince people. The way you explain, there was a fatal flaw which I pointed it out. -
JW?Originally posted by Icemoon:No good .. go and brush up your rhetorical skills.
God as a creator only pertains to the world (heavens and the earth) and the heavenly realms. Therefore, it is possible God created Christ and let Christ do all the saikang creation.
So Christ is still creator of everything, but he himself is created by someone higher than him. -
Well, the Old Testament existed during the time of Jesus. so we only need to deal with the NT. Depending on who you are listening to. The NT can be a carefully selected set of books to support Christian theology (see Dan Brown's books). The Christian POV is that while, yes, the books were selected, they were selected based on a strict criteria of authorship.Originally posted by MohamedF:I heard from Nat Geo that the Bible is actually written 100 years after Christians beileve that Jesus was crucified... So what is your view about the chances that his words were distorted in the 100 years of verbal teachings?
Nope the Bible was NOT WRITTEN 100 yrs after the death of Christ. It is PUT TOGETHER about 100 yrs after the death of Christ.... a little different. -
so this isnt really an issue yeah?Originally posted by Icemoon:No good .. go and brush up your rhetorical skills.
God as a creator only pertains to the world (heavens and the earth) and the heavenly realms. Therefore, it is possible God created Christ and let Christ do all the saikang creation.
So Christ is still creator of everything, but he himself is created by someone higher than him.
what is an issue is the fact that atheists say that nature can also self exist like God.
Actually, the point about the creator, therefore not the created, was already explained by Aristotle way early in the 19th century ??
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Originally posted by davidche:Actually, the point about the creator, therefore not the created, was already explained by Aristotle way early in the 19th century ??
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WHATS SO FUNNY YOU!!...YOU......LOL GUY!!!???!!!Originally posted by Icemoon:
Well maybe the timing isnt right, but the main facts are right.
And theres oso this Louis Pretzel(forgive my spelling) who said that there is no link between a living and non living thing. Very impt discovery in the evolution world.
Im thinking of bumping the creationism thread. -
Pasteur.Originally posted by davidche:WHATS SO FUNNY YOU!!...YOU......LOL GUY!!!???!!!
Well maybe the timing isnt right, but the main facts are right.
And theres oso this Louis Pretzel(forgive my spelling) who said that there is no link between a living and non living thing. Very impt discovery in the evolution world.
Im thinking of bumping the creationism thread.
I went for Tong's expository sermon one ok. -
hmmm.
bookmark first, read later
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hah!! caught you again!!!Originally posted by Icemoon:Pasteur.
I went for Tong's expository sermon one ok.
tats why i thought that you r a christian mah!! you seem so serious in christainity.
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so how do you feel about the sermon? is it sufficient by itself? Quite all rounded and includes complex stuffs that i dont understand.Originally posted by Icemoon:Pasteur.
I went for Tong's expository sermon one ok. 
which is why its always good to have audio, then can repeat the part that you dont know, and plus can also listen on my bed. -
Wrong.Originally posted by davidche:hah!! caught you again!!!
tats why i thought that you r a christian mah!! you seem so serious in christainity.
I am serious in what God has to say.
So whereas you are always thinking of what Christianity has to say about God, I am thinking of what God has to say through Christianity. -
I think his theological sermons are better.Originally posted by davidche:so how do you feel about the sermon? is it sufficient by itself? Quite all rounded and includes complex stuffs that i dont understand.
which is why its always good to have audio, then can repeat the part that you dont know, and plus can also listen on my bed.
I have one drawer of his tapes .. around 35 of them .. ALL on the book of Hebrews. -
lol, i borw them from st andrews church library. The left ones i donated them to another church library liao.Originally posted by Icemoon:I think his theological sermons are better.
I have one drawer of his tapes .. around 35 of them .. ALL on the book of Hebrews.
maybe you wanna pass it ard. keeping it within your house definitely wont benefit ppl yah? Just an opinion. -
This has got to be the best quote your nick have ever held so far.Originally posted by Icemoon:Wrong.
I am serious in what God has to say.
So whereas you are always thinking of what Christianity has to say about God, I am thinking of what God has to say through Christianity.
Respect.
Cheers -
I have several questions:
Why are we sinners? is it because some woman defied God's command to eat a certain apple, thus causing all her issues to be branded as sinful?
Also, would you consider genocide a sin and an evil deed?
How would you see one who requires such unquestioned loyalty and obedience so as to "test" others' degree of loyalty by asking them to kill their own children to "prove" that loyalty?
What do you think of one who does not "lead" and "teach" by example?
What would you think of me if I decree that those whom I perceived have "wronged" me will suffer an eternal punishment, along with all his/ her descendants up to the 4th generation?