Were all christians once catholic?
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I was sitting in the canteen a couple of days ago and we started talking about religion. Two particular things really stumped me
1) My catholic friend said that christians were originally from the catholic church, however they disagreed with some bits of the bible and thus formed the christian church.
Being a christian my whole life, i was stumped by this.
2) They also claim that all christians are protestants. And this was even further backed up by a former christian.
Right at this point, you can imagine i was going like "huh?!?!?!"
I mean i had always though that protestants were a seperate thing, only in ireland. I mean thinking about it, i think they have a head bishop and all right? Not like our autonomous christian churches in singapore.
Would anyone care to elaborate on 1 & 2?
Thanks -
Let me elaborate.
In the beginning there was one Church. It was founded by Jesus Christ with St Peter as the first Pope, the Vicar of Christ. The phrase 'Catholic Church' was coined by St Ignatius of Antioch in 107, who wrote: "Where the bishop appears, there let the people be, just as where Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church."
In 1054 AD, the Great Schism took place. The Church split into half, East and West. The Eastern Church called themselves the Orthodox. There were differences over culture, language and certain doctrines. The Orthodox did not accept the authority of the Pope over all Christians. Despite this, both Catholicism and Orthodoxy recognise the Sacraments, Veneration of the Saints and have much in common. Some Orthodox Churches finally conceded and were reunited with Rome. They are called Eastern Rite Catholics.
In the 16th Century, the Protestant Reformation took place. The Church was relatively corrupt during that time of history. It first sparked off in Germany by a former Augustinian monk Martin Luther. He tried to reform the Church, but was fed up, and so he left to set up his own church. It soon spread to other parts of Europe, and these Christians were now known as Protestants.
As time went by, these Protestants disagreed even amongst themselves, and as a result split into hundreds of different churches. Orthodoxy was also subject to many divisions. The Catholic Church remains as Church which has stood the test of time for Jesus Christ promised that the gates of hell would not prevail against Her. -
In short, if you are a Christian, you are either:
Catholic OR Protestant OR Orthodox -
SGMacross, eh... dis means dat those churches NOT of catholic are considered idolatory places? As in not the true churches of God and Christ? Then will these churches be condemned because they are not catholic?
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So there were no pastors in the first place?
Oh I get it
The priest wanted to get married so got the term pastor? 
Note:correct me if I'm wrong -
Very Informative!
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Macca has pretty much covered what I wanted to say.
Bonta: As long as they do the work of God we don't see a reason to condemn them. -
I wouldn't say idolatrous, because Protestants and the Orthodox worship Jesus Christ. Schismatic and heretical are more correct words.Originally posted by Bontakun:SGMacross, eh... dis means dat those churches NOT of catholic are considered idolatory places? As in not the true churches of God and Christ? Then will these churches be condemned because they are not catholic?
I will leave it to your judgement. -
There are some independent churches out there that don't fit into any of the three, right?Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:I wouldn't say idolatrous, because Protestants and the Orthodox worship Jesus Christ. Schismatic and heretical are more correct words.
I will leave it to your judgement. -
Oh... Coz I am abit confused once I read da post you made. Thanks for clarifying and thanks to Kuali baba too.Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:I wouldn't say idolatrous, because Protestants and the Orthodox worship Jesus Christ. Schismatic and heretical are more correct words.
I will leave it to your judgement.
Even though my faith in God never wavers by dis though I not catholic. -
interesting... who are the Orthodox? what do they believe that is different from Catholic and Protestant? care to enlighten me?Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:In short, if you are a Christian, you are either:
Catholic OR Protestant OR Orthodox -
Oh yeah, I forgot about those.Originally posted by Kuali Baba:There are some independent churches out there that don't fit into any of the three, right?
I think 'independent' Catholic chapels are considered to be schismatic... -
Do not be stumped. Tell your Catholic friend to read more bible or at least attend bible study classes.Originally posted by zer0kool:1) My catholic friend said that christians were originally from the catholic church, however they disagreed with some bits of the bible and thus formed the christian church.
Being a christian my whole life, i was stumped by this.Acts 11:
As you can see, the christian church has already been there at Antioch, which predates anything your friend can tell you from their Catholic tradition.
26and when he had found him, he brought him to Antioch. So it was that for an entire year they associated with* the church and taught a great many people, and it was in Antioch that the disciples were first called ‘Christians’.2) They also claim that all christians are protestants. And this was even further backed up by a former christian.
If Catholics like them have no wish to be associated with Christians, then I feel sorry for them.
Regardless of what your church tells you, what the tradition tells you, what your pastor or priest tells you, always remember you swear allegiance to God.
For it is written,
4There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to the one hope of your calling, 5one Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6one God and Father of all, who is above all and through all and in all. (Ephesians 4) -
Originally posted by ventin:interesting... who are the Orthodox? what do they believe that is different from Catholic and Protestant? care to enlighten me?
No offense .. but I always thought you are knowledge about Christianity.
It seems that your knowledge of church history is wanting, regardless of how you like to draw attentions to certain historical figures or events that discredit the
Catholic faith. -
Just as there are other Christians who put down Catholicism, there are Catholics whose actions and words are just as regretable. There were also Protestants told me that they were the real McCoys.
There was only one Church in the beginning and after the schisms each Church would've evolved differently. It'd be nice to know what the practices, traditions and teachings of the original Church are - not to contest who has been the most "faithful" though, but for our individual appreciation.
Let's work towards Christian unity instead of fighting among ourselves. -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Orthodox_ChurchOriginally posted by ventin:interesting... who are the Orthodox? what do they believe that is different from Catholic and Protestant? care to enlighten me? -
Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:
Catholics like to present their magistrium as having descended from the Apostle Peter, but this argument is tenuous at best.
[b]In the beginning there was one Church. It was founded by Jesus Christ with St Peter as the first Pope, the Vicar of Christ. The phrase 'Catholic Church' was coined by St Ignatius of Antioch in 107, who wrote: "Where the bishop appears, there let the people be, just as where Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church."
[b]
Because Christianity from the very beginning was disunited. The Apostle Peter belonged to the Jewish sect but still compromise (read: concede) to the Apostle Paul who wanted to make Christianity 'free for all'.
Catholics are candid about the Great Schism and the Protestant Reformation, but they are usually silent about the theological wars which took place during the early years of Christianity. The intention is clear - they want to present the Protestant reformers as usurpers of a millennium old faith which has always been strong with the occassional dispute. (and they will tell you why the Great Schism isn't as bad as you think)
I'm interested to know how many of you actually know who is Marcion?Marcion of Sinope (ca. 110-160), was a major 2nd century Early Christian theologian, founder of what would later be called Marcionism, and one of the first to be strongly denounced by other Christians (who would later be called Catholic as opposed to Marcionite) as heretical. He created a strong ecclesiastical organization, parallel to that of the Church of Rome, with himself as Bishop. The Catholic Encyclopedia says of the Marcionites "they were perhaps the most dangerous foe Christianity has ever known."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marcion -
- nvm, i dun think i want to go there-
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Get your PHD first.Originally posted by ben1xy:- nvm, i dun think i want to go there-
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Schismatic and heretical ?Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:I wouldn't say idolatrous, because Protestants and the Orthodox worship Jesus Christ. Schismatic and heretical are more correct words.
I will leave it to your judgement.
is this an offical view of the catholic church? or just a passing remark of a personal view? -
Originally posted by vince69:Schismatic and heretical ?
is this an offical view of the catholic church? or just a passing remark of a personal view? -
This is the view of the Church, though these days we are afraid to say it aloud.Originally posted by vince69:Schismatic and heretical ?
is this an offical view of the catholic church? or just a passing remark of a personal view? -
Indeed, Christianity was quite divided at it's beginning. Maybe the Gnostics are right?Originally posted by Icemoon:Catholics like to present their magistrium as having descended from the Apostle Peter, but this argument is tenuous at best.
Because Christianity from the very beginning was disunited. The Apostle Peter belonged to the Jewish sect but still compromise (read: concede) to the Apostle Paul who wanted to make Christianity 'free for all'.
Catholics are candid about the Great Schism and the Protestant Reformation, but they are usually silent about the theological wars which took place during the early years of Christianity. The intention is clear - they want to present the Protestant reformers as usurpers of a millennium old faith which has always been strong with the occassional dispute. (and they will tell you why the Great Schism isn't as bad as you think)
I'm interested to know how many of you actually know who is Marcion?
The Orthodox aren't that bad; at least they have sacraments and all..
And, what's your take on Marcionism? -
i will have more time on my hands after mid-november. i dun want to engage in debate halfway and run away to do my work.. so i better not startOriginally posted by Icemoon:Get your PHD first. 
btw it's PhD (lower caps h). yes i am picky -
You should know mah .. Protestantism is still on the heretics list of the Catholics.Originally posted by vince69:Schismatic and heretical ?
is this an offical view of the catholic church? or just a passing remark of a personal view?
Schismatic is by definition. Some Protestants refuse to accept the Catholic as brethens in Christ, this makes it all the more schismatic. Don't even talk about ecumenism.