Originally posted by Ironside:I feel that many Protestants are guilty of d).
Practical Application:
What are you doing with the truth of the Gospel, dear reader? ItÂ’s meant to benefit us sinners like you and me.
Are you trusting it?
a)You are not trusting the Gospel [the work of salvation by the Lord Jesus Christ] if you attempt to be right with God through good works.
b)You are not trusting the Gospel if you believe that somehow your good deeds can lessen and atone for your sins.
c)you are not trusting the Gospel if you think that it's your good works + the Gospel can get you to enter the Kingdom of heaven.
d) you do not have true faith in the Gospel if you do not reciieve it with a repentant heart.
Originally posted by Icemoon:I feel that many Protestants are guilty of d).
The Gospel has became their excuse to sin.
If the Gospel is this - “The Lord Jesus Christ died for the sins of sinners, buried and resurrected for us." - then an overemphasis or rather wrong understanding of justification by faith will lead to that.Originally posted by M©+square:
How has the gospel become excuse to sin?
if a person wants to commit a sin, he don't need an excuse to do it, he just needs the guts to do it (NOTE: wants to, does not means will, just maybe don't have the chance/ability to do it).Originally posted by Icemoon:I feel that many Protestants are guilty of d).
The Gospel has became their excuse to sin.
That is only a handful of people, when they misunderstood the meaning of the central message.Originally posted by Icemoon:If the Gospel is this - “The Lord Jesus Christ died for the sins of sinners, buried and resurrected for us." - then an overemphasis or rather wrong understanding of justification by faith will lead to that.
I disagree, because the gospel can be conveniently misused to support their position. Here are some common "excuses":Originally posted by vince69:if a person wants to commit a sin, he don't need an excuse to do it, he just needs the guts to do it (NOTE: wants to, does not means will, just maybe don't have the chance/ability to do it).
if a person don't want to sin, give him ten thousands excuse, he also don't want to sin (NOTE: Don't want does not means won't).
I hope I am wrong about the numbers.Originally posted by M©+square:That is only a handful of people, when they misunderstood the meaning of the central message.
Ok. I see your point.
Hmm...i'd reserve my comments.Originally posted by Icemoon:I hope I am wrong about the numbers.
we encourage diversity of opinions.Originally posted by M©+square:Hmm...i'd reserve my comments.
Don't wish to be too critical about this.
Then its not use as "an excuse to sin" but more like a "cover up of their guilt"Originally posted by Icemoon:I disagree, because the gospel can be conveniently misused to support their position. Here are some common "excuses":
1. "Who are you to judge me?" .. then they quote their favourite verse. Effectively it means they can explain away any sins with the verse.
2. "It doesn't matter what they think of us 'cos we have God's grace blah blah". Effectively it means they need not self-reflect. If Jesus has forgiven you, who are others to condemn you?
The sad thing is some might not even know they have fallen. so it is not correct to say they feel guilty and are finding a cover in the Gospel.Originally posted by vince69:Then its not use as "an excuse to sin" but more like a "cover up of their guilt"
The proper use of God's grace is this, that there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. It is this no condemnation that we, when we do fall (and I bet you, many like me who are imperfect do fall, though it may not be intentational), we can rest in this grace of God, stand up and continue our walk with God, instead of just lie there on the ground and continue in the fallen state.
Like Jesus said, I do not condemn you, now go and sin no more. The power of knowing there now no more condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, gives the ability to resist the temptation of sin.
Imagine if a person thinks God condemn him, you think he dares to go to God and repent and change for the better meh?
This is what Paul saysOriginally posted by Icemoon:The sad thing is some might not even know they have fallen. so it is not correct to say they feel guilty and are finding a cover in the Gospel.
Your scenario is not very correct leh. 'cos we know God's condemnation, if any, won't last forever.
Roman 8:1-8
1Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus,[a] 2because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death. 3For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature,[b] God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering.[c] And so he condemned sin in sinful man,[d] 4in order that the righteous requirements of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the sinful nature but according to the Spirit.
5Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. 6The mind of sinful man[e] is death, but the mind controlled by the Spirit is life and peace; 7the sinful mind[f] is hostile to God. It does not submit to God's law, nor can it do so. 8Those controlled by the sinful nature cannot please God.
so there are true and false christians?Originally posted by gasband:But the irony is this, that if a christian had truly repented and received Christ into his life, the Holy Spirit would fill him. Therefore a true christian would never be really able to use the gospel to cover for his sins becos the Holy Spirit in him would be prompting him all the time that he has sins in his life... this is like what David describes in his psalm that when he is far from God, its like his life being sapped away......
He who knows he was forgiven much, loved much;Originally posted by gasband:But the irony is this, that if a christian had truly repented and received Christ into his life, the Holy Spirit would fill him. Therefore a true christian would never be really able to use the gospel to cover for his sins becos the Holy Spirit in him would be prompting him all the time that he has sins in his life... this is like what David describes in his psalm that when he is far from God, its like his life being sapped away......
Being a christian is afterall a very personal and private thingy between you and God. Some people when saying the sinner's prayer do not mean it at all. A good example is my fren who says the prayer with me 12 years ago. I was sincere. But for him, just a few months later, he tells me that he said it becos of me, i say thats why he says, he did not know what was happening at all. When I ask him whether he wants to say the prayer again albeit sincerely, he says he will think about it...until today he still thinking hahaha....Originally posted by laurence82:so there are true and false christians?
Woohoo!!!!Originally posted by laurence82:so there are true and false christians?
I think the temptation is still there. It is easy to fall to the dark side.Originally posted by gasband:But the irony is this, that if a christian had truly repented and received Christ into his life, the Holy Spirit would fill him. Therefore a true christian would never be really able to use the gospel to cover for his sins becos the Holy Spirit in him would be prompting him all the time that he has sins in his life... this is like what David describes in his psalm that when he is far from God, its like his life being sapped away......
more like,Originally posted by laurence82:so there are true and false christians?
what is the origin of this sinner's prayer?Originally posted by gasband:Being a christian is afterall a very personal and private thingy between you and God. Some people when saying the sinner's prayer do not mean it at all. A good example is my fren who says the prayer with me 12 years ago. I was sincere. But for him, just a few months later, he tells me that he said it becos of me, i say thats why he says, he did not know what was happening at all. When I ask him whether he wants to say the prayer again albeit sincerely, he says he will think about it...until today he still thinking hahaha....
yeah that is very true....very very true...Originally posted by Icemoon:I think the temptation is still there. It is easy to fall to the dark side.
The important thing is whether you realize you have fallen, repent with a contrite heart and make restitution.
By the fruits of salvation?Originally posted by vince69:more like,
there are christians and there are non-christians (I am not sure how you want to classify, those who profess they are christians not actually are not, but then how to tell them apart?)
The sinner's prayer is just a general term. There is no standard or correct prayer. It is basically a prayer for a non christian to accept the salavtion and acknowledged Christ as his/her saviour and Lord.Originally posted by Icemoon:what is the origin of this sinner's prayer?
I feel very wayang leh .. machiam like initiation rite liddat.
They are many so called ways to differentiate but i guess there is no foolproof way and I guess the only way we will know is when we see God in heaven.Originally posted by Icemoon:By the fruits of salvation?