Some questions from Roman Catholics...
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Originally posted by Ironside:
Amen and Thank you Ironside.
Forgiveness is by grace through faith IN CHRIST. It can be had anytime the repentant sinner trust in Christ alone for salvation.
The channel is faith. The source is God by His grace. Preachers are to proclaim the message of forgiveness of sins. they do not have inherent power in themselves to forgive. it's through the message that they bear that brings forgivenss when appropriated by faith.
Israel had their priests [in fact a whole tribe] but when David sinned he confessed his sin to God and found forgiveness:
[b] I acknowledged my sin to You, And my iniquity I have not hidden. I said, "I will confess my transgressions to the LORD," And You forgave the iniquity of my sin.
Yes, they go to their priests for sin offering and other offerings but the priests was never given power to forgive. it was through faith in the coming Savior pre-figured by their sacrifices that Old Testament saints found forgiveness.
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It is an edifying post. -
Originally posted by Ironside:
Technically, we do have a priest that can forgive sins, a high priest actually. Christ Jesus our Lord, who is also our high priest, standing before God mediating for us, day and night.
Forgiveness is by grace through faith IN CHRIST. It can be had anytime the repentant sinner trust in Christ alone for salvation.
The channel is faith. The source is God by His grace. Preachers are to proclaim the message of forgiveness of sins. they do not have inherent power in themselves to forgive. it's through the message that they bear that brings forgivenss when appropriated by faith.
Israel had their priests [in fact a whole tribe] but when David sinned he confessed his sin to God and found forgiveness:
[b] I acknowledged my sin to You, And my iniquity I have not hidden. I said, "I will confess my transgressions to the LORD," And You forgave the iniquity of my sin.
Yes, they go to their priests for sin offering and other offerings but the priests was never given power to forgive. it was through faith in the coming Savior pre-figured by their sacrifices that Old Testament saints found forgiveness.
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God bless -
Hmmm.....if only i can get my friend here and share with u.....she says there are many misconception abt Roman Catholics.....after she went to a RC church....Originally posted by Icemoon:This is a trap question.
But I think their explanation is clear - the priests are the authorized representatives of God. So the power still comes from God. -
You mean Protestants misunderstanding Catholics?Originally posted by laoda99:Hmmm.....if only i can get my friend here and share with u.....she says there are many misconception abt Roman Catholics.....after she went to a RC church....
Is this new?
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amen. He is both the priest and sacrifice Himself.Originally posted by vince69:Technically, we do have a priest that can forgive sins, a high priest actually. Christ Jesus our Lord, who is also our high priest, standing before God mediating for us, day and night.
God bless -
Not newOriginally posted by Icemoon:You mean Protestants misunderstanding Catholics?
Is this new? -
I will copy and paste some answers from a thread elsewhere.
Why do Catholics confess their sins to priests? What makes them think that priests can absolve them of the guilt of their sins? Why don't they confess their sins directly to God as Protestants do?
Catholics confess their sins to priests because, as it is clearly stated in Sacred Scripture, God in the Person of Jesus Christ authorized the priests of His Church to hear confessions and empowered them to forgive sins in His Name. To the Apostles, the first priests of His Church, Christ said: "Peace be to you. As the Father hath sent me, I also send you...Receive ye the Holy Ghost. Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained." (John 20:21-23). Then again: "Amen I say to you, whatsoever you shall bind upon earth, shall be bound also in heaven; and whatsoever you shall loose upon earth, shall be loosed also in heaven." (Matt. 18:18 ). In other words, Catholics confess their sins to priests because priests are God's duly authorized agents in the world, representing Him is all matters pertaining to the ways and means of attaining eternal salvation. When Catholics confess their sins to a priest they ARE, in reality, confessing their sins to God, for God hears their confessions and it is He who, in the final analysis, does the forgiving. If their confessions are not sincere, their sins are not forgiven.
Furthermore, Catholics do confess their sins directly to God as Protestants do: Catholics are taught to make an act of contrition at least every night before retiring, to ask God to forgive them their sins of that day. Catholics are also taught to say this same prayer of contrition if they should have the misfortune to commit a serious sin (called a "mortal sin" by Catholics).
Granting that priests do have the power to forgive sins in the name of God, what advantage does confessing one's sins to a priest have over confessing directly to God in private prayer?
Catholics see several advantages in confessing their sins to a priest in the Sacrament of Penance. First, there is the Church's guarantee of forgiveness, which private confessions do not provide; secondly, there is the sacramental grace which private confessions do not provide; and thirdly, there is the expert spiritual counselling which private confessions do not provide. With the Apostles, Catholics recognize that the Church is, in a mysterious way, the Body of Christ still living in the world (Col. 1:18 ); therefore they recognize that God will receive their pleas for mercy and forgiveness with far greater compassion if their pleas are voiced within the Church, in union with the Mystical Body of His Divine Son, than if they are voiced privately, independent of the Mystical Body of His Divine Son.
Do Catholics confess all the sordid details of their sins to the priest?
No, Catholics are instructed not to confess the sordid details of their sins, because it would serve no useful purpose. All that is required of the penitent is the number and classification of sins committed, as well as a sincere contrition for having sinned, a promise to make restitution if the sin has harmed others, a firm resolve to avoid future sins and the occasions of sin, and the carrying out of the penance assigned by the priest (usually the praying of a few prayers). Actually, there are fewer intimacies revealed to the priest in the confessional than are usually revealed to one's doctor, lawyer, or psychiatrist; hence the Sacrament of Penance is not the embarrassing experience many non-Catholics imagine it is. Rather, it is a wonderful relieving experience, for it is through this sacrament that sins committed after Baptism are washed away by the blood of Christ and the sinner becomes once again reconciled with God.
http://www.sgforums.com/?action=thread_display&thread_id=92087 -
what does it mean by 'guarantee of forgiveness'? will the priest say "you are forgiven"?Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:Catholics see several advantages in confessing their sins to a priest in the Sacrament of Penance. First, there is the Church's guarantee of forgiveness, which private confessions do not provide; -
Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:
What sort of nonsense is this?
[b]
Catholics see several advantages in confessing their sins to a priest in the Sacrament of Penance. First, there is the Church's guarantee of forgiveness, which private confessions do not provide; secondly, there is the sacramental grace which private confessions do not provide; and thirdly, there is the expert spiritual counselling which private confessions do not provide. With the Apostles, Catholics recognize that the Church is, in a mysterious way, the Body of Christ still living in the world (Col. 1:18 ); therefore they recognize that God will receive their pleas for mercy and forgiveness with far greater compassion if their pleas are voiced within the Church, in union with the Mystical Body of His Divine Son, than if they are voiced privately, independent of the Mystical Body of His Divine Son.
[b]
1.The church cannot guarantee forgiveness, only Yahweh can.
2. You mean that only if I confess in church will I gain Yahweh's grace??? No. All believers have grace because of the work of Yeshua on the cross.
3. The priests have expert spiritual counsellling? Hmmm.
4. You mean that by confessing in church, God is more willing to listen to our pleas? Then what about the places where there are no churches? How then? Gods ear is trained on the cry of those who love Him, to show Himself strong on our behalf. The plea of a confession voiced privately is just as strong as one confessed in chuch, it is all dependent on the heart of the one repenting. Whether there is true repentence or not. Where in the bible does it say that by confessing in church that there is greater weight placed on that confession????
Now this is the kind of heresy that I am talking about! The RC church by saying this are teaching lies!!! -
Dun be so worked up la...he is speaking from RC point of view.....Originally posted by breytonhartge:What sort of BS is this?
1.The church cannot guarantee forgiveness, only Yahweh can.
2. You mean that only if I confess in church will I gain Yahweh's grace??? No. All believers have grace because of the work of Yeshua on the cross.
3. The priests have expert spiritual counsellling? Hmmm.
4. You mean that by confessing in church, God is more willing to listen to our pleas? Then what about the places where there are no churches? How then? Gods ear is trained on the cry of those who love Him, to show Himself strong on our behalf. The plea of a confession voiced privately is just as strong as one confessed in chuch, it is all dependent on the heart of the one repenting. Whether there is true repentence or not. Where in the bible does it say that by confessing in church that there is greater weight placed on that confession????
Now this is the kind of heresy that I am talking about! The RC chuch by saying this are teaching lies!!! -
And as they the RC church account for quite a sizeable number of "believers" in Yeshua, i think that the RC chuch should have the responsibility of teaching truth and not spouting half truths and lies and passing them off as truth!Originally posted by laoda99:Dun be so worked up la...he is speaking from RC point of view..... -
Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:
i like the SURE promise of God better than all these:
I will copy and paste some answers from a thread elsewhere.
[b]Why do Catholics confess their sins to priests? What makes them think that priests can absolve them of the guilt of their sins? Why don't they confess their sins directly to God as Protestants do?
Catholics confess their sins to priests because, as it is clearly stated in Sacred Scripture, God in the Person of Jesus Christ authorized the priests of His Church to hear confessions and empowered them to forgive sins in His Name. To the Apostles, the first priests of His Church, Christ said: "Peace be to you. As the Father hath sent me, I also send you...Receive ye the Holy Ghost. Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained." (John 20:21-23). Then again: "Amen I say to you, whatsoever you shall bind upon earth, shall be bound also in heaven; and whatsoever you shall loose upon earth, shall be loosed also in heaven." (Matt. 18:18 ). In other words, Catholics confess their sins to priests because priests are God's duly authorized agents in the world, representing Him is all matters pertaining to the ways and means of attaining eternal salvation. When Catholics confess their sins to a priest they ARE, in reality, confessing their sins to God, for God hears their confessions and it is He who, in the final analysis, does the forgiving. If their confessions are not sincere, their sins are not forgiven.
Furthermore, Catholics do confess their sins directly to God as Protestants do: Catholics are taught to make an act of contrition at least every night before retiring, to ask God to forgive them their sins of that day. Catholics are also taught to say this same prayer of contrition if they should have the misfortune to commit a serious sin (called a "mortal sin" by Catholics).
Granting that priests do have the power to forgive sins in the name of God, what advantage does confessing one's sins to a priest have over confessing directly to God in private prayer?
Catholics see several advantages in confessing their sins to a priest in the Sacrament of Penance. First, there is the Church's guarantee of forgiveness, which private confessions do not provide; secondly, there is the sacramental grace which private confessions do not provide; and thirdly, there is the expert spiritual counselling which private confessions do not provide. With the Apostles, Catholics recognize that the Church is, in a mysterious way, the Body of Christ still living in the world (Col. 1:18 ); therefore they recognize that God will receive their pleas for mercy and forgiveness with far greater compassion if their pleas are voiced within the Church, in union with the Mystical Body of His Divine Son, than if they are voiced privately, independent of the Mystical Body of His Divine Son.
Do Catholics confess all the sordid details of their sins to the priest?
No, Catholics are instructed not to confess the sordid details of their sins, because it would serve no useful purpose. All that is required of the penitent is the number and classification of sins committed, as well as a sincere contrition for having sinned, a promise to make restitution if the sin has harmed others, a firm resolve to avoid future sins and the occasions of sin, and the carrying out of the penance assigned by the priest (usually the praying of a few prayers). Actually, there are fewer intimacies revealed to the priest in the confessional than are usually revealed to one's doctor, lawyer, or psychiatrist; hence the Sacrament of Penance is not the embarrassing experience many non-Catholics imagine it is. Rather, it is a wonderful relieving experience, for it is through this sacrament that sins committed after Baptism are washed away by the blood of Christ and the sinner becomes once again reconciled with God.
http://www.sgforums.com/?action=thread_display&thread_id=92087[/b]
"if we confess our sins He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness?" -
Thank goodness... not every Christian talks like this .Originally posted by breytonhartge:What sort of BS is this?
1.The church cannot guarantee forgiveness, only Yahweh can.
2. You mean that only if I confess in church will I gain Yahweh's grace??? No. All believers have grace because of the work of Yeshua on the cross.
3. The priests have expert spiritual counsellling? Hmmm.
4. You mean that by confessing in church, God is more willing to listen to our pleas? Then what about the places where there are no churches? How then? Gods ear is trained on the cry of those who love Him, to show Himself strong on our behalf. The plea of a confession voiced privately is just as strong as one confessed in chuch, it is all dependent on the heart of the one repenting. Whether there is true repentence or not. Where in the bible does it say that by confessing in church that there is greater weight placed on that confession????
Now this is the kind of heresy that I am talking about! The RC church by saying this are teaching lies!!!
We still have other Christians in EH forum who are serious in discussion and learning from one another, instead of starting a war.
Praise God for that. -
Not starting a war, like I said, if the RC's are responsible for a majority of the believers in Yeshua, they had better get their facts straight and RIGHT!Originally posted by Honeybunz:Thank goodness... not every Christian talks like this .
We still have other Christians in EH forum who are serious in discussion and learning from one another, instead of starting a war.
Praise God for that.
Though I apologise for the language used... edited...
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watched an episode of Simpsons last night.... Bart and Homer got involved with the Catholic church to the displeasure of Marge, Ned Flanders and their Protestant Pastor.
Marge went to the Catholic school to get Bart back, where Bart retorted with something like, "all your life you want me to go to church, and now I am in church, and enjoying it, you drag me away..."
Almost the end of the show, Bart said, why are you focussing on the little differences between the two groups and ignore the similarities???? -
because it is the differences that make the difference.Originally posted by Chin Eng:Almost the end of the show, Bart said, why are you focussing on the little differences between the two groups and ignore the similarities????
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I am leaning towards calvinism/reformed these days, but I won't say catholics are entirely wrong.Originally posted by breytonhartge:because it is the differences that make the difference.
As an elder in my church tells me, all will be revealed to us when we go heaven. So in the mean time, we do our best to study what is right and share with others. -
the elect are already elected.Originally posted by breytonhartge:because it is the differences that make the difference. 
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how's the talk by Stephen Tong?Originally posted by Icemoon:the elect are already elected. -
IMHO, the bible warns of a greater enemy who performs miracles and preaches what your itching ear wants to hear.Originally posted by breytonhartge:Not starting a war, like I said, if the RC's are responsible for a majority of the believers in Yeshua, they had better get their facts straight and RIGHT!
Though I apologise for the language used... edited...
The Catholics are a misunderstood lot. Protestants have much to learn from them. -
is this the correct topic?Originally posted by laoda99:how's the talk by Stephen Tong?
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u not on msn mah....Originally posted by Icemoon:is this the correct topic?
is the talk good? -
true, but only when we continue to harp about it......Originally posted by breytonhartge:because it is the differences that make the difference.
I totally disagreed with speaking in tongues and health/wealth, but I don't harp about it.
...so what does the similiarities make???? -
....because nobody is entire right!Originally posted by laoda99:I am leaning towards calvinism/reformed these days, but I won't say catholics are entirely wrong. -
the point is this, even if it is 1% wrong, it is wrong... you either teach the Word of Yahweh or not... you either follow Yahweh 100% or you don't. If the RC church teaches things that are not in line with the Word of Yahweh, then they are not doing the right thing, Yeshua did not ask us to teach the doctrines of man, but the ways of our God.Originally posted by laoda99:I am leaning towards calvinism/reformed these days, but I won't say catholics are entirely wrong.
As an elder in my church tells me, all will be revealed to us when we go heaven. So in the mean time, we do our best to study what is right and share with others.