Is smoking a sin?
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Smoking, like some other practices such as masturbation are not mentioned in the Bible. But their absence from the Scripture doesnt warrant them non-sins.
The Christian life is a personal relationship between God and Man bridged together throught the reconciling sacrifice of Jesus Christ on the cross. Does smoking, an act that harms the body God created and given us glorifies God? If it does, by all means do it.
We are all given a conscience and by nature we all know what is pleasing to God and what is not. need i say more?
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Faith by bible, or faith by church?
Martin Luther would have turned over in his grave -
Then refute me.Originally posted by Raptured:These things are not unknown as you claimed. They are prevalent & fashionable now even famous. Rock music might be limited to this century but smoking, drinking alcohol, food offered to idols, homosexuality & gambling have been with us for a very very long time & very very famous even in Apostles' days in Israel!
That's why Paul blasted the homos, Peter advised not to be drunk with wine but be drunk with the Spirit. Jesus condemned idolaters & homosexuals etc in Revelations & He is coming back to burn them all up! Gambling is a form of coveting & Paul struggled with this sin of coveting himelf in Romans 7. Thank God He forgives!
So i still dont think what you said is correct. They are prevalent, very famous & known to the whole wide world!
Quote and prove your point. -
Thank you MC for the well raised references. Yes, it would seem right that the best wine - is the best wine. Nothing diluted should come from the heart of Christ.Originally posted by M©+square:Joh 2:3 And when they wanted wine(Onios), the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine(Onios).
Joh 2:9 When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine(Onios), and knew not whence it was : (but the servants which drew the water knew) the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,
Joh 2:10And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine(Onios); and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine(Onios) until now.
It is not Grape Juice. But of cos, there are many camps in this issue. Feel free to differ.
"Onios" suggested full bodied, old wine - and it appears to me that the men of those times are "good" drinkers (180 gallons) perhaps because wine is one of their staple diet (as wine was much easier to come by than drinking water).
The Bible didnt stipulate that the wedding guests finished up all 180 gallons - and perhaps it just signified that Jesus blessed overflowingly.
But the alcohlic content of even the best wine then, might not be as high as those of ours today - due to global warming - as some scientist believed. -
So what if it is a sin or not? So what? Nothing.
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I agree with Raptured that addiction to stuff other than God Himself is sin. Although it is not applicable to all.. but i personally felt that the need to lightup has overtook my time to pray/ talk to God. Slowly i no longer tell my daily stuff to God and seek His guidance and i relied on smoking to take my troubles away.. sadly.. as time passed.. i dont talk to God anymore..
Depending on how u see it... to me not putting God above all other addiction.. .. it's a sin. Not that He'll be angry with us..rather He'll be sad ba..
same for ma**bation, listening to rock music.. same for alcohol drinking -
Thanks for your comment. Sometimes we enjoy sin so much that we just leave God. i wonder if one loses his salvation then.Originally posted by odi-o:I agree with Raptured that addiction to stuff other than God Himself is sin. Although it is not applicable to all.. but i personally felt that the need to lightup has overtook my time to pray/ talk to God. Slowly i no longer tell my daily stuff to God and seek His guidance and i relied on smoking to take my troubles away.. sadly.. as time passed.. i dont talk to God anymore..
Depending on how u see it... to me not putting God above all other addiction.. .. it's a sin. Not that He'll be angry with us..rather He'll be sad ba.. same for ma**bation, listening to rock music.. same for alcohol drinking -
i don't need to quote. You go see for yourself. No time to do research.Originally posted by M©+square:Then refute me.
Quote and prove your point.
Chinese have chi he piao du. Gluttony, wine, prostitute, gambling. You also have the famous Liang Zhu story where there is homosexuality involved.
As for masturbation, you never masturbated before meh? Ancient artefacts have been unearthed which shows pornographic images. It was on the papers some time ago. -
It's important bcos if it's a sin, you can go to hell for that!Originally posted by casino_king:So what if it is a sin or not? So what? Nothing.
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You always fall sick or got no time.Originally posted by Raptured:i don't need to quote. You go see for yourself. No time to do research.
Chinese have chi he piao du. Gluttony, wine, prostitute, gambling. You also have the famous Liang Zhu story where there is homosexuality involved.
As for masturbation, you never masturbated before meh? Ancient artefacts have been unearthed which shows pornographic images. It was on the papers some time ago.
No problem.
I'm happy with my research and my views. -
It's ok if you are happy with your research & your views. This is a free market of ideas. I could prove my point if i want to. Or anyone can prove his point if he wants to. That's why so many conflicting views with as much validity & proof as each other.Originally posted by M©+square:You always fall sick or got no time.
No problem.
I'm happy with my research and my views. -
So how do you prove Smoking is a sin?Originally posted by Raptured:It's ok if you are happy with your research & your views. This is a free market of ideas. I could prove my point if i want to. Or anyone can prove his point if he wants to. That's why so many conflicting views with as much validity & proof as each other. -
How do you prove smoking is not a sin then?Originally posted by M©+square:So how do you prove Smoking is a sin?
If smoking not sin, will it harm your body? Sin is something you do which is out of the will of God for your body, mind, soul, spirit etc. God did not create people to smoke. I remember Ps Prince said in one of his sermons, if God created people to smoke, He would create a smoke chimney for a nose. Imagine your nose pointing upwards like a smoke stack.
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Are you related to Repented John 2? How come you all attend Ps Prince's sermons one? Too much of a coincidence bah.Originally posted by Raptured:How do you prove smoking is not a sin then?
If smoking not sin, will it harm your body? Sin is something you do which is out of the will of God for your body, mind, soul, spirit etc. God did not create people to smoke. I remember Ps Prince said in one of his sermons, if God created people to smoke, He would create a smoke chimney for a nose. Imagine your nose pointing upwards like a smoke stack. 
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MC,Originally posted by M©+square:So how do you prove Smoking is a sin?
there is no direct reference in the bible that says smoking is a sin, in fact its not even directly mentioned at all.
But there is a ref that says our body is the temple of God.
so the question is, is smoking good or harmful to our body, and also those around us. since it is harmful to the body, then we should not be doing it.
conclude,
smoking is not a sin, by itself, it won't send anyone to hell, but it will most likely send that person to meet God earlier, or should I say, prematurely. -
Agree.Originally posted by vince69:MC,
there is no direct reference in the bible that says smoking is a sin, in fact its not even directly mentioned at all.
But there is a ref that says our body is the temple of God.
so the question is, is smoking good or harmful to our body, and also those around us. since it is harmful to the body, then we should not be doing it.
conclude,
smoking is not a sin, by itself, it won't send anyone to hell, but it will most likely send that person to meet God earlier, or should I say, prematurely.
Though i'm not sure if you're on my side.
Personally, i'm irked by people who throws in issues which were unsaid/unclear in the bible and make it a 'standard' (man-made rules)
Like - Smoking is a sin, gambling is a sin, masturbation is a sin...etc
To make matters worse, these people goes around telling/teaching others these man made rules.
There was this teaching about 'No BGR if you're under 21' in a ministry. THEY clearly stated BGR is not the calling of God, study hard and honor your parents is the Calling. The youth pastor did not state it is a sin. Fair Enough.
But the implications of the teaching made youths believe that going into BGR before they're 'of age' is WRONG. This is WRONG.
So whoever in the youth ministry engages into BGR, the leaders will zealously seperate the couple, or counsel them(to breakup) or to monitor the couple closely. Youth who have relationship were finger pointed and given 'one kind of look.'
Instead of tackling this man-made standard in a positive note, which the Youths could appreciate and have a objective view about BGRs. They were misled to think BGR are evil and harmful.
This man-made standard that could have prevented youthful lust and many heartaches, to a misguided context of a Godly Issue.
When these issues have no clear instructions. It is all up to the wisdom and knowledge of THE believer to safe guard himself, live life according to the word and be accountable to the holy spirit.
My point being, anything and everything could be harmful. eg. Partake too much oily food, delibrate bad sleeping habits, careless habit of managing our health.
Smoking is not a sin. Yes, i agree with you vince.
Once again, my view is:-
If the believer thinks he could live with smoking and truthfully worship God at the same. So be it.
Is it sin then? I don't know, however, i'm sure that it displeases God. And God desire him to be perfect; recieve full blessings of health. If he feels the need to change, then let him be dealt by God in the closet. If he knows God is dealing with him about the habits which displeases Him(God), YET he delibrately continue in his ways. HE SINS.
This is the Sin of disobedience. Period.
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At end state. Christians can do anything and everything, but all things are to be accounted before the Most Holy One.
Like what Odi-O have mentioned 'God is sad', i'd use the word GRIEVE.
God is grieved when He sees his people indulge in our matters which holds more importance than Him.
Love God first, and the believers have no time to indulge on these issues.
I'll leave the verse Paul mentioned.
God will in due time deal with individuals in their problems.
Philippians 3
15All of us who are mature should take such a view of things. And if on some point you think differently, that too God will make clear to you.
16Only let us live up to what we have already attained. -
Heh....let me push a notch up.Originally posted by Raptured:How do you prove smoking is not a sin then?
If smoking not sin, will it harm your body? Sin is something you do which is out of the will of God for your body, mind, soul, spirit etc. God did not create people to smoke. I remember Ps Prince said in one of his sermons, if God created people to smoke, He would create a smoke chimney for a nose. Imagine your nose pointing upwards like a smoke stack.
Eph 1:5 He predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will
Revelation 4:11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created. (KJV)
God create men for His pleasure,
so does created being born with defective looks pleasure God?
Does God take pleasure in painful diseases inflicted onto his creation?
I'm not here to question God's intent.
I just don't agree with JP's(or your own) presentation, a weak statement. -
Absolutely crap analogy.... I am not pro-smoking.... but that kind of statement can also be twisted to: God intended for us to masturbate 'cos we have appendages to play with.... duh!Originally posted by Raptured:I remember Ps Prince said in one of his sermons, if God created people to smoke, He would create a smoke chimney for a nose. Imagine your nose pointing upwards like a smoke stack. -
Amen!Originally posted by M©+square: If he knows God is dealing with him about the habits which displeases Him(God), YET he delibrately continue in his ways. HE SINS.
This is the Sin of disobedience. Period. -
You will go to Middle Earth and live with elves and hobbits are more like it.Originally posted by Raptured:It's important bcos if it's a sin, you can go to hell for that!
For educated people to indulge in fantasy is one thing but to revolve your lives around ideas and tactics used to scare children is pathetic.
Smoking causes cancer and other health problems. Period. -
But we did have a good laugh when he said this over the pulpit.Originally posted by Chin Eng:Absolutely crap analogy.... I am not pro-smoking.... but that kind of statement can also be twisted to: God intended for us to masturbate 'cos we have appendages to play with.... duh!
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Originally posted by vince69:But we did have a good laugh when he said this over the pulpit.
all I can say is: responsible speakers are hard to come by...... -
Originally posted by vince69:But we did have a good laugh when he said this over the pulpit. I guess i'll be the only one who'd frown if i was there.
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more like a balance speaker is hard to come by..Originally posted by Chin Eng: all I can say is: responsible speakers are hard to come by......
too serious ... become boring ... people fell asleep ...
too funny ... people laugh ... but risk having the message being diluted ...
too much indepth analysis ... younger christians lost ...
too much simplified preaching ... older christians feels no meat ...
conclusion....
there is no such thing as a perfect preacher that can please everyone, just like there is no perfect church (at least until the Lord's return)
God Bless... -
Well, if you have the ability to prove that smoking IS indeed sin.Originally posted by Raptured:It's ok if you are happy with your research & your views. This is a free market of ideas. I could prove my point if i want to. Or anyone can prove his point if he wants to. That's why so many conflicting views with as much validity & proof as each other.
Then i don't see why do you not wish to prove it.
By proving and stating the truth.
You not only make a statement like you did in your first post. It's not the first time.
You will substaintiate it with solid studies and research, that will convience people to agree with your statement.
Whether they are convienced. It's their choice.
What you're doing now is like this -
Since smoking is harmful to our bodies and the word spoke of our body as the temple of God. Therefore, to harm our body is sin.
Conclusion, Smoking is sin.
Then you dodge questions.
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People can only prove when there's substance!
Are Truths without prove and substance, but by plain assumption? That's not how truths work.
If you have what it takes to make a stand. Present it.
I'll be more than happy to discuss it with you.