Lets talk about Jesus.
-
So good you pay for me. I buy nachos we share.Originally posted by M©+square:MC pay $6.50 for HBz seat.
Nah, free one liao.
-
Steady....Originally posted by Honeybunz:So good you pay for me. I buy nachos we share.
-
ok ok... what's going on here??????
sgforums flirting????
-
CEOriginally posted by Chin Eng:ok ok... what's going on here??????
sgforums flirting????
its just open flirting....
oh... before I forget... must on the big spot lights till bright bright....
-
* switches off lights... *
* draws the curtains.... *
* go home no show... all over... * -
Originally posted by breytonhartge:
You read carefully.
Genesis 14:14-20, read for yourself.
14 When Abram heard that his relative had been taken captive, he called out the 318 trained men born in his household and went in pursuit as far as Dan. 15 During the night Abram divided his men to attack them and he routed them, pursuing them as far as Hobah, north of Damascus. 16 He recovered all the goods and brought back his relative Lot and his possessions, together with the women and the other people.
17 After Abram returned from defeating Kedorlaomer and the kings allied with him, the king of Sodom came out to meet him in the Valley of Shaveh (that is, the King's Valley).
18 Then Melchizedek king of Salem [d] brought out bread and wine. He was priest of God Most High, 19 and he blessed Abram, saying,
"Blessed be Abram by God Most High,
Creator [e] of heaven and earth.
20 And blessed be [f] God Most High,
who delivered your enemies into your hand."
[b]Then Abram gave him a tenth of everything. [/b]
Abraham gave Melchizedek the war spoilts .. not his personal property.
-
errr... the war spoils were actually his personal property, can you not understand english?Originally posted by Icemoon:You read carefully.
Abraham gave Melchizedek the war spoilts .. not his personal property. -
This is FOS. When did Lot's property become Abram's property?Originally posted by breytonhartge:errr... the war spoils were actually a reclamation of his personal property, can you not understand english?
From same chapter:11So the enemy took all the goods of Sodom and Gomorrah, and all their provisions, and went their way; 12they also took Lot, the son of AbramÂ’s brother, who lived in Sodom, and his goods, and departed. 13 Then one who had escaped came and told Abram the Hebrew, who was living by the oaks* of Mamre the Amorite, brother of Eshcol and of Aner; these were allies of Abram.
Abram didn't even tiok dai ji! -
Gen 14:11-12Originally posted by Icemoon:Abram didn't even tiok dai ji!
11 The four kings seized all the goods of Sodom and Gomorrah and all their food; then they went away. 12 They also carried off Abram's nephew Lot and his possessions, since he was living in Sodom.
Gen14:15-16
15 During the night Abram divided his men to attack them and he routed them, pursuing them as far as Hobah, north of Damascus. 16 He recovered all the goods and brought back his relative Lot and his possessions, together with the women and the other people.
The war spoils were a reclamation of all of the goods of Sodom and Goomorrah and this Abraham took. So therefore the spoils of war were his personal property because he had won them in battle, therefore he gave a tenth of all that he recovered. Nothing is mentioned about him tithing Lots property. -
Originally posted by breytonhartge:The war spoils were a reclamation of all of the goods of Sodom and Goomorrah and this Abraham took. So therefore the spoils of war were his personal property because he had won them in battle, therefore he gave a tenth of all that he recovered. Nothing is mentioned about him tithing Lots property.
You just turned Abraham into a big robber! Remember Ali Baba and 40 Thieves?
Sorry, but Abraham don't think your way. He refused to admit those were his personal property.
Please don't turn Abraham into a thief. He never earned those things. Those things were never rightfully his.And Abram gave him one-tenth of everything. 21Then the king of Sodom said to Abram, ‘Give me the people, but take the goods for yourself.’ 22But Abram said to the king of Sodom, ‘I have sworn to the Lord, God Most High,* maker of heaven and earth, 23that I would not take a thread or a sandal-thong or anything that is yours, so that you might not say, “I have made Abram rich.”
-
When he won all the things as spoils of war, he immediately gave a tenth to Melchizedek. But after Melchizedek had left, the king of sodom came and asked abraham to give him the people and keep the possessions. These possessions that abraham had was what was left after he had already tithed to Melchizedek. So rather than let the king of sodom get all the glory, even what was left, abraham gave away so as not to allow the king of sodom to steal any glory in abrahams blessing.Originally posted by Icemoon:
You just turned Abraham into a big robber! Remember Ali Baba and 40 Thieves?
Sorry, but Abraham don't think your way. He refused to admit those were his personal property.
Please don't turn Abraham into a thief. He never earned those things. Those things were never rightfully his.
Are you blind or can you not understand english? Melchizedek came before the king of sodom and it is clearly written that Abraham gave a tenth of all. What does it mean to tithe? It means to give a tenth.
I am not turning abraham into a theif, i think you are the one that is warping the story. -
what is tithing? do you offer ten percent of your gross salary, or do you deduct the cpf contribution? or 10% of take home after tax? if you receive compensation for retrenchment, do you offer also 10%? if one kenna golden handshake and have to retire, should he offer 10%?Originally posted by breytonhartge:Original quote by babbys..
This is like saying if you feel good, you don't sin, if you feel down and out, you sin... God understands...
How about God saying this to you... well if you are good you go to Heaven, if you are bad, well you go to you know where...
tithing is not optional.
If you give some money to help the poor or the sick, is it counted under tithe?? -
10% gross. In my opinion. Your tithe is the money you give to God.Originally posted by sgdiehard:what is tithing? do you offer ten percent of your gross salary, or do you deduct the cpf contribution? or 10% of take home after tax? if you receive compensation for retrenchment, do you offer also 10%? if one kenna golden handshake and have to retire, should he offer 10%?
If you give some money to help the poor or the sick, is it counted under tithe??
with the golden handshake... it is not technically considered income, it is a compensation, but it depends on how you see things. If you consider it income, then you tithe your 10% and God will bless it for you.
You tithe on your income gross. In my opinion. -
I debated on this for a while, tax is one of the issue here, what we pay to the government is not our income so should be deducted before we offer, this is more so in countries where you pay up to 40% tax.Originally posted by breytonhartge:10% gross. In my opinion. Your tithe is the money you give to God.
with the golden handshake... it is not technically considered income, it is a compensation, but it depends on how you see things. If you consider it income, then you tithe your 10% and God will bless it for you.
You tithe on your income gross. In my opinion.
should we pay tithe on a yearly basis or a monthly basis, bearing in mind some got very small salary but big bonus at the end of the year. If I kenna insurance, car road tax, children schools books and my mother in law hospitalisation within the same month, and I offer less than 10%, but end of the year I offer more when I get my bonus, would I be guilty of not tithing for that particular month?
There is the employer's contribution of CPF which is our money so we should offer 10% of that, but we never have it in cash, so should we pay 10% now or wait untill we withdraw our CPF (though i don't know when ....)
compensation is for loss of future income and therefore should be considered income. rightfully we should also offer 10%? not sure. also not sure about golden handshake, sometimes I hear people got tax for that but some got it tax free, its all in the name of definition, how the accountant and tax men define them.
I have concluded that while offering to God is not an option for all chrisitans and blessed are those who offer willingly, tithing should not be taken as a non option, unless there is a clear definition that applies at all time and in all places. if you offer one cent less than the 10% of your income, then you are not tithing, but if the "income" is subject to different interpretations, then tithing would be a moving target, it should therefore be a guideline for Christian at most. just my opinion. Hope we don't have to appoint accountant to verify what each of us should be offering. -
I the most 'bo chap' care less type, I normally take the gross salary, round it up to nearest hundred then divide it by 10 (easier to write the cheque also), yearend bonus, wait till year end then say....Originally posted by sgdiehard:I debated on this for a while, tax is one of the issue here, what we pay to the government is not our income so should be deducted before we offer, this is more so in countries where you pay up to 40% tax.
should we pay tithe on a yearly basis or a monthly basis, bearing in mind some got very small salary but big bonus at the end of the year. If I kenna insurance, car road tax, children schools books and my mother in law hospitalisation within the same month, and I offer less than 10%, but end of the year I offer more when I get my bonus, would I be guilty of not tithing for that particular month?
There is the employer's contribution of CPF which is our money so we should offer 10% of that, but we never have it in cash, so should we pay 10% now or wait untill we withdraw our CPF (though i don't know when ....)
compensation is for loss of future income and therefore should be considered income. rightfully we should also offer 10%? not sure. also not sure about golden handshake, sometimes I hear people got tax for that but some got it tax free, its all in the name of definition, how the accountant and tax men define them.
I have concluded that while offering to God is not an option for all chrisitans and blessed are those who offer willingly, tithing should not be taken as a non option, unless there is a clear definition that applies at all time and in all places. if you offer one cent less than the 10% of your income, then you are not tithing, but if the "income" is subject to different interpretations, then tithing would be a moving target, it should therefore be a guideline for Christian at most. just my opinion. Hope we don't have to appoint accountant to verify what each of us should be offering.
No need accountant to check one, simple mathematics, our own conscience will convict us faster than God.
Just my personal opinion
God bless -
i agree with you on this vince. This is exactly what I do... .Originally posted by vince69:I the most 'bo chap' care less type, I normally take the gross salary, round it up to nearest hundred then divide it by 10 (easier to write the cheque also), yearend bonus, wait till year end then say....
No need accountant to check one, simple mathematics, our own conscience will convict us faster than God.
Just my personal opinion
God bless -
is that tithing??Originally posted by vince69:I the most 'bo chap' care less type, I normally take the gross salary, round it up to nearest hundred then divide it by 10 (easier to write the cheque also), yearend bonus, wait till year end then say....
No need accountant to check one, simple mathematics, our own conscience will convict us faster than God.
Just my personal opinion
God bless -
This is how I decide how much to tithe,...Originally posted by sgdiehard:is that tithing?? (doesn't means its the definite correct method, others can have their own way of computing)
anyway, keep things simple yah... don't think we need a complex formulae to decide on the amount to tithe afterall the more important part of the tithe is the attitude of a willing/thankful heart.
again, just a persona opinion -
You skirted around the issue again.Originally posted by breytonhartge:When he won all the things as spoils of war, he immediately gave a tenth to Melchizedek. But after Melchizedek had left, the king of sodom came and asked abraham to give him the people and keep the possessions. These possessions that abraham had was what was left after he had already tithed to Melchizedek. So rather than let the king of sodom get all the glory, even what was left, abraham gave away so as not to allow the king of sodom to steal any glory in abrahams blessing.
Are you blind or can you not understand english? Melchizedek came before the king of sodom and it is clearly written that Abraham gave a tenth of all. What does it mean to tithe? It means to give a tenth.
I am not turning abraham into a theif, i think you are the one that is warping the story.
Before Abraham gave the 10% to the High Priest, were the spoils of war his personal property? You need to distinguish between finding $10 on the road and knowing your friend dropped his $10 in front of you.
If you claim the spoils of war were his personal property, then you're turning Abraham into a plunderer, a robber and a liar 'cos only these people think spoils of war are their personal property. -
Actually come to think of it, you are skirting the issue. The original issue is tithing. I said abraham tithed. I have also backed this up with biblical support. Gen 14. So the issue is not what abraham tithed, it is whether he did tithe. And this he did.Originally posted by Icemoon:You skirted around the issue again.
Before Abraham gave the 10% to the High Priest, were the spoils of war his personal property? You need to distinguish between finding $10 on the road and knowing your friend dropped his $10 in front of you.
If you claim the spoils of war were his personal property, then you're turning Abraham into a plunderer, a robber and a liar 'cos only these people think spoils of war are their personal property.
it is obvious that your comprehension skills are a little wanting so I will not discuss this topic with you any further. I believe that I have made my point. You are free to ramble on if you so wish.
Cheers
Genesis 14:20 KJV
20And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And he gave him tithes of all. -
sg, with God, you want to calculate to the exact 10% is it? Wah... with what vince is doing, he is giving his 10% definitely, whatever may be over, it can then be considered an offering. The money is God's so why be so stingy when we return it to Him? Do you not know that He will bless your tithing?Originally posted by sgdiehard:is that tithing?? -
why use the word tithe in the first place, if you are not sure if it is correct.Originally posted by vince69:This is how I decide how much to tithe,... (doesn't means its the definite correct method, others can have their own way of computing)
anyway, keep things simple yah... don't think we need a complex formulae to decide on the amount to tithe afterall the more important part of the tithe is the attitude of a willing/thankful heart.
again, just a persona opinion
The most important part is Christians must offer, in response to the love and grace of God. Such offering would include our time, our possessions,........
Willingness and thankfulness is part of your offering.
to keep things simple, when it comes to offering, give whatever you can, especially where the needs are there, don't count, 10% or not. -
tithing is calculating, if you can offer more, why not more? If your employer declared windfall profits and give all employee 6 months extra bonus, offering 3 months of your bonus will not affect you. why limit at 10%?Originally posted by breytonhartge:sg, with God, you want to calculate to the exact 10% is it? Wah... with what vince is doing, he is giving his 10% definitely, whatever may be over, it can then be considered an offering. The money is God's so why be so stingy when we return it to Him? Do you not know that He will bless your tithing? -
Originally posted by breytonhartge:
Wait.
[b]Actually come to think of it, you are skirting the issue. The original issue is tithing. I said abraham tithed. I have also backed this up with biblical support. Gen 14. So the issue is not what abraham tithed, it is whether he did tithe. And this he did.
it is obvious that your comprehension skills are a little wanting so I will not discuss this topic with you any further. I believe that I have made my point. You are free to ramble on if you so wish.
Cheers [/b]
It was not mentioned explicitly in the Scripture that action was tithing.
So if I pay 10% tax also tithing? -
if you wanna tithe to the exact amount, its upto you as the Holy Spirit convicts. God Bless.Originally posted by sgdiehard:tithing is calculating, if you can offer more, why not more? If your employer declared windfall profits and give all employee 6 months extra bonus, offering 3 months of your bonus will not affect you. why limit at 10%?