Can Christians m**turbate?
-
Great. Now we have more constructive feedback abt m***turbation. That's what i intended in the beginning abt this taboo subject. (but now not so taboo considering the liberal stance of so many young people)
-
The thing is, although you may lust after that lady/man, you cannot gain anything if the lady/man does not reciprocate the same amount of lust back at you. And the way you potray it, you make it seem like masturbation is something evil. To me, its something that is normal and its not a problem.Originally posted by brown_obsession:Love is an act of priotising others at an expense of oneself unlike lust which is an act of priotising oneself at an expense of others,when u lust , u r taking others as an object
Honestly, when i first became a christian i struggled to get rid of this masturbation habit. In fact i am still now but fortunately the involvement of Holy Spirit has rescued me many times!(Thanx God , Jesus and Holy Spirit!)
Always seek someone to share ur problems(it may be embarrasing but seek for the Kingdom of God first!!) if possible from the same gender.
the strategy is :
1. Submit to God (when your bubbling hormones are working or some pretty sexy lady walk past u and u get turned on) and request for His help.
2.Use His Word as a weapon , for eg. my personal weapon is Psalm 119:103 "I have restrained my feet from every evil ways that i may keep His Word." and James 1:13 "Let no one say when he is tempted 'I am tempted by God' for God cannot be tempted by evil nor He Himself tempt anyone"
3.Go out for a short walk or do something productive to divert ur attention away.
well i think it is a serious problem and i believed there are some Christians who are experiencing the same problem but has no one to approach.
I know when u ask for forgiveness , God is just and faithful and He will forgive us from all our unrighteouness but do not take advantage of His grace.
if anyone having the same problem can always approach me
God never let us a too big temptation that we cannot handle , remember that! -
Isnt masturbation lust? & the way you do in the mind to that person isnt that rape in the mind?Originally posted by shade343:The thing is, although you may lust after that lady/man, you cannot gain anything if the lady/man does not reciprocate the same amount of lust back at you. And the way you potray it, you make it seem like masturbation is something evil. To me, its something that is normal and its not a problem. -
Masturbation isnt lust. Its a form of self release. when you masturbate do you always think of raping the object of desire? I think not.Originally posted by Raptured:Isnt masturbation lust? & the way you do in the mind to that person isnt that rape in the mind? -
But in your mind you have sex what. So when that person doesnt like you & you "force" sex, then isnt that rape or molest?Originally posted by shade343:Masturbation isnt lust. Its a form of self release. when you masturbate do you always think of raping the object of desire? I think not. -
Your "rape" and "molest" are not of this world.Originally posted by Raptured:But in your mind you have sex what. So when that person doesnt like you & you "force" sex, then isnt that rape or molest?
Stretching it too far by linking whatever in your mind with raping or molesting that person. -
I agree with shady this time.Originally posted by Raptured:But in your mind you have sex what. So when that person doesnt like you & you "force" sex, then isnt that rape or molest?
Masterbate is self release. It is possible someone who not known sex but enjoys masterbating. -
Hmm....i think you got to sort out your thought before you present your statement again.Originally posted by Raptured:Isnt masturbation lust? & the way you do in the mind to that person isnt that rape in the mind?
1. Masterbation is a private act
2. Lust is a thought not yet leading to act.
3. Rape is an act against another person's will - an act which affects another person.
Clearly, you have not phrased this topic in a proper sense.Originally posted by Raptured:Yea, the question is can Christians m**turbate? Dont go into semantics of can or should bcos every normal person can.
You intentionally ask in this manner to led people to make a stand whether if it is a SIN or not.
Why not ask directly? Your issue isn't about can or cannot, it is sinful or not.
Why make unknown subjects become a code of conduct?
- Should/can Christians listen to Rock music?
- Can Christians smoke?
- Can Christians Drink alcohol?
- Can Christians eat food offered to idols/anccestor worship?
- Can Christians accept homosexual breathen into the congregation?
- Can Christians play poker cards or Mahjong as form of entertainment?
NT2 have voiced out in another thread that True christians wouldn't do this and that. I agree with him, but are we looking at the wrong things?
Have Christians missed the focus? Are you seeking endorsement?
I say this once again. People can conceal themselves very well and have a 'Christian Conduct' in front of many. But IF their hearts ain't clean. Whats the point?
Lets look at it practically:
a) A single Christian who struggles with masturbation and lift the issue to God. Fervent Christian and humble in service of God and Church.
Just that he have this 'thorn'...
b) A married Christian who have high sexual drive always have the need to 'release'. Unfortunately his Christian wife do not have as much desire as he does, she rejects him. He felt that the intimate times were cutting down. He turns to masterbation. He is too a fervent and humble in service of God and Church.
c) A single Christian who have high sexual drive, he does not see masterbation as a Sinful act.
Fervent Christian and humble in service of God and Church.
What would you do if you have the chance to offer your counsel to him?
________________
I need to address this.
It is one thing to Displease God. And another to commit a Sin.
God's grace and chastisement and God's Tolerance towards Sinful act/thought are different matters
Christians need to get this right before they conclude on Grey areas.
_________________
To me, it takes Conviction to know what God thinks and this conviction is personal.
We know how some church teaches that small tithing and offering is sin and a sign of unbelief. How personal issues with God can become a matter of an Act of Faith before the christians.
This is a very practical issue which no Christians decides whichever Act is Sinful or Holy.
Personal Level.....personal level.
Cheers -
well....even though i dunno u much...u can see for urselves some ppl have schizo...Originally posted by breytonhartge:laurence if you cannot show respect to other people, how do you expect others to show you any? I will moderate your posts if you cross this line.
Name calling will not be tolerated here.
For the record, the forum EH is started by sillyme, I just help out. But I am glad that some people here enjoy the forum and are encouraged by it. This is what it should be.
at times come here and act cute and involve in christian topics eventhough he isnt a christian before at all.....and at times give people nick name and persistently wanna cause trouble because of the simple fact things spoken here are not to his liking and favour.
he is a sadist...he like to dwell among people that say things he dun like to hear. -
LL, you knew i stopped entertaining him long ago. You knew it was pointless, so why carry on. Let the topic carry onOriginally posted by LazerLordz:IMHO, Lau's posts are good because they help to avoid a streak of fundamentalism and it does tone down some potentially serious inter-religious bashing sessions. -
But he can't be banned as he has the favour of Jason and FireIce. I say put CenturionMBT as admin and this place will be cleaned up.Originally posted by NT2:well....even though i dunno u much...u can see for urselves some ppl have schizo...
at times come here and act cute and involve in christian topics eventhough he isnt a christian before at all.....and at times give people nick name and persistently wanna cause trouble because of the simple fact things spoken here are not to his liking and favour.
he is a sadist...he like to dwell among people that say things he dun like to hear. -
Christian or non-Christian , we still have sinful nature with us. If u think Christians dont commit sin , u r wrong. However, we believed that our sins are cleansed by the faith in Jesus Christ. When i first became a Christian , it is difficult to change many old habits but i kept i trying (stop scolding vulgarities, stop gambling and as far as possible, to be a good citizen , good son, good student and etc) . After a while , it became a second nature. Even my old friends made fun of me ('cos i dont scold vulgarities anymore, i am branded as a goodie boy).Originally posted by M©+square:I say this once again. People can conceal themselves very well and have a 'Christian Conduct' in front of many. But IF their hearts ain't clean. Whats the point?
r u interested to read a bible if i buy u one? can always PM me cheers to u too! -
Orh ok.Originally posted by brown_obsession:Christian or non-Christian , we still have sinful nature with us. If u think Christians dont commit sin , u r wrong. However, we believed that our sins are cleansed by the faith in Jesus Christ. When i first became a Christian , it is difficult to change many old habits but i kept i trying (stop scolding vulgarities, stop gambling and as far as possible, to be a good citizen , good son, good student and etc) . After a while , it became a second nature. Even my old friends made fun of me ('cos i dont scold vulgarities anymore, i am branded as a goodie boy).
r u interested to read a bible if i buy u one? can always PM me cheers to u too!
My post was unclear. My fault.
Cheers -
Wah! your angmoh so good should be so unclear what..... maybe it's because brownie's a noob..... I understood exactly what you were sayingOriginally posted by M©+square:Orh ok.
My post was unclear. My fault.
Cheers -
Maybe should link Brownie to past links.Originally posted by Chin Eng:Wah! your angmoh so good should be so unclear what..... maybe it's because brownie's a noob..... I understood exactly what you were saying
But no point la...
I think i should just delete the whole post. 
Otherwise, the rest start whacking me for my unclear message.
Then confirm my english cannot make it liaoz.
Cheers -
I said rape in the mind lah! In the mind! Imaginary rape which might lead to rape. There have been studies that p0rn leads to rape or molest. Just recently in Koh Samui, a tourist was raped & killed by two thais who watched p0rn before they attacked her.Originally posted by M©+square:Hmm....i think you got to sort out your thought before you present your statement again.
1. Masterbation is a private act
2. Lust is a thought not yet leading to act.
3. Rape is an act against another person's will - an act which affects another person.
I am not seeking endorsement. I am bringing it out again for discussion. Can I dictate what another Christian should & could do unless I am the spiritual father of that person who has no choice but to listen to me since i am the mentor?Originally posted by M©+square:NT2 have voiced out in another thread that True christians wouldn't do this and that. I agree with him, but are we looking at the wrong things?
Have Christians missed the focus? Are you seeking endorsement?
Yes what's the point? I agree with you. But who is perfect here on this earth? You mean you want to expose everyone including yourself before you will want to become a Christian? We become a Christian bcos we were sinners in the first place. If one is perfect, then he can go to heaven on his own. There will be a final judgement & who can stand?Originally posted by M©+square:I say this once again. People can conceal themselves very well and have a 'Christian Conduct' in front of many. But IF their hearts ain't clean. Whats the point?
What do you mean? Commit sin = displease God. How can God be tolerant towards sin? If everybody just depend on personal conviction, then havoc results bcos one can do this & the other can do that happily. Where is the final word then? Chaos man!Originally posted by M©+square:________________
I need to address this.
It is one thing to Displease God. And another to commit a Sin.
God's grace and chastisement and God's Tolerance towards Sinful act/thought are different matters
Christians need to get this right before they conclude on Grey areas.
_________________
To me, it takes Conviction to know what God thinks and this conviction is personal.
We know how some church teaches that small tithing and offering is sin and a sign of unbelief. How personal issues with God can become a matter of an Act of Faith before the christians.
This is a very practical issue which no Christians decides whichever Act is Sinful or Holy.
Personal Level.....personal level. -
Originally posted by Raptured:
all these goes back to my original question..... what's the intention of this thread? You obviously have the answer already.
What do you mean? Commit sin = displease God. How can God be tolerant towards sin? If everybody just depend on personal conviction, then havoc results bcos one can do this & the other can do that happily. Where is the final word then? Chaos man! -
Bcos i sin like this sometimes. But it's less now. So i go to hell or what?Originally posted by Chin Eng:all these goes back to my original question..... what's the intention of this thread? You obviously have the answer already. -
Originally posted by Raptured:Bcos i sin like this sometimes. But it's less now. So i go to hell or what?
Is this the only sin one can commit? Doesn't everybody sin? Isn't your salvation freely given to you despite of your sin? Is perpetual sinlessness the condition for salvation? Did anyone tell you that after your received you salvation, you will go to heaven? -
refer to unker's post.Originally posted by Raptured:Bcos i sin like this sometimes. But it's less now. So i go to hell or what?
Me replying the longer post.
-
I dun see the fuss over this.
Its a non-issue at all...
Religion is meant to unite, NOT divide. -
anyway understanding the needs and urge for some people..
i would consider masturbation to be better den going out to find some pros to curb ur sexual desires..
if course its still bad,but i do find it slightly less sinful if there ever is such a word or term.. -
It's true. You'll never know if those prossies are carrying any STDs in the first place.Originally posted by stellazio:anyway understanding the needs and urge for some people..
i would consider masturbation to be better den going out to find some pros to curb ur sexual desires..
if course its still bad,but i do find it slightly less sinful if there ever is such a word or term.. -
thats not the point la..i'm just saying that to satisfy ur sexual desire if it can't be helped..its better to mast den to find pros to f***...Originally posted by iveco:It's true. You'll never know if those prossies are carrying any STDs in the first place. -
Don't twist words leh.Originally posted by Raptured:I said rape in the mind lah! In the mind! Imaginary rape which might lead to rape. There have been studies that p0rn leads to rape or molest. Just recently in Koh Samui, a tourist was raped & killed by two thais who watched p0rn before they attacked her.
Rape is rape. You can choose what terms you want - imaginary rape or subconsious lust etc.
Now you got it too far, you've gotten Porn, rape and molest in this discussion.
It's about Masterbation, stick to your topic.
Then what is the purpose? Like what Chin Eng have asked. What is the point for bringing out grey issues when it wasn't mentioned in the Word? I'm not talking about dictation, again i take it as a benefit of doubt; my message was written unclear.Originally posted by Raptured:I am not seeking endorsement. I am bringing it out again for discussion. Can I dictate what another Christian should & could do unless I am the spiritual father of that person who has no choice but to listen to me since i am the mentor?
To have agreement that the act of masterbation is a SIN?
Why make matters which doesn't concern the Law become a Law? Which is what men is good at already.
If a Christian could link the Sin of Lust and unclean thoughts to masterbation only. Then i keep quiet; tiam tiam.
Simply because that Christian doesn't understand the effect of that Law. It doesn't stay in one subject, it affects all subject.
Will you tell a Christian brethen that listening to Rock music is WRONG because he like it? How wrong is it?
If i say - yes! Masterbation is wrong! Christians CANNOT masterbate because masterbaters will go to hell!
Will Christians stop doing?
Again i apologise for the poor deliverance of my message. Clearly it was misunderstood.Originally posted by Raptured:Yes what's the point? I agree with you. But who is perfect here on this earth? You mean you want to expose everyone including yourself before you will want to become a Christian? We become a Christian bcos we were sinners in the first place. If one is perfect, then he can go to heaven on his own. There will be a final judgement & who can stand?
Exposing of sins and ungodly habits has got to be of the Work of Holy Spirit.
Likewise, you can have the form of Godliness but without power of God.
2Tim 3:5 - having a form of godliness but denying its power.
What's the point?
I see where you're coming from when you explain how man become Christian.
I personally beg to differ.
The focus of salvation is LOVE. You know that someone loves you unconditionally and you used to belong to him. He wants you embrace Him again.
The measure of sinfulness of men and the sacrifice He has made, just to win your heart.
The beauty of salvation and the great exchange could not be summed up by mere words.
The Effect of Sin is Judgement. No two ways about it.Originally posted by Raptured:What do you mean? Commit sin = displease God. How can God be tolerant towards sin? If everybody just depend on personal conviction, then havoc results bcos one can do this & the other can do that happily. Where is the final word then? Chaos man!
God's tolerance onto Sin is displayed in Sodom and Gomorrah, also in the Moses and the Isrealites(Mosaic era)
Read my post again.
It is one thing to Displease God. And another to commit a Sin.
1) Acts which displeases God
2) Act of commited Sin - forbade by God
1 and 2 is not the same. But the effect is similiar.
1 - A minister have a loving wife and 5 kids. He spends more time with his church works, counselling the needy and goes to house visitation, looking after the welfare of his congretation. The only time his family gets to see him is morning, breakfast.
The spirit calls him to spend time with family, he argued that the people needs him.
He continues his ministering style and years goes by. His children commited crimes, fights and immoral acts.
His wife got involved in extra marital affair.
He asked God, why. God answered.
It has displeased God that this minister have forsaken the institution which God have regarded highly. The institution is called HOME, family.
Instead of taking care of his own home. He thought God's house is more important.
If a minister does not know how to take good care of his own Home. How good a testimony he is before his congregation?
It displeases God, but it is not Sin.
Every created being have this power of choice. To keep himself in check.
And through Conviction, the check can be effective and consistent.
Masterbation is not a sinful act.
There is this line which one will cross onto boundary of sin.
You still haven't answer me these question::::
Focus on pleasing God and find out with displeases Him. You'll be more productive than posting this question.Originally posted by M©+square:Lets look at it practically:
a) A single Christian who struggles with masturbation and lift the issue to God. Fervent Christian and humble in service of God and Church.
Just that he have this 'thorn'...
b) A married Christian who have high sexual drive always have the need to 'release'. Unfortunately his Christian wife do not have as much desire as he does, she rejects him. He felt that the intimate times were cutting down. He turns to masterbation. He is too a fervent and humble in service of God and Church.
c) A single Christian who have high sexual drive, he does not see masterbation as a Sinful act.
Fervent Christian and humble in service of God and Church.What would you do if you have the chance to offer your counsel to him?
Cheers