something to ask the christian frens here..
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yup, this is one part which i disagree with, even though i like his/her thoughts on this issue.. =POriginally posted by Ito_^:but there are many words that remained constant, and one of them refer to reaching God through Jesus and Jesus alone. many things didn't change. really.
thats why its incorrect to force the idea of reincarnation (actually, u were refering to regeneration, not reincarnation, different things) and the idea of going through other mediums to reach God, to Christians.
not to partake in Holy Communion is one thing, but advocating a Christian to worship to Buddha as though he is Christ is another thing altogether.
the monotheistic and the reincarnation schools are very different in their philosophies.. hence, was kind of surprised to hear reincarnation being part of christians beliefs..
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well because i know that there's only one God and He's the only one who can judge us on the last day by faith.Originally posted by earthlings73:err.. right.. and why should we believe you in your claim that buddha, guan yin, etc are not god?
at least dan brown's work is based on certain other proper research.. though it's quite controversial i must admit..
somehow, buddha, guanyin are not convincing. haha. guanyin from a man, become womanly like... then reincarnation blah... I only have one God, and nothing's gonna convince me into believing in other "man made gods".
dan brown... u relate him to proper reseach? i say ur guanyin married a man and started a family. u belive not? if dan brown wrote that, i think u'll also believe in that lar i suppose? -
the question wld be, is BBC documentary to be trusted? and wad would be the reaction of the religous orders when its confirmed as true.Originally posted by earthlings73:One BBC documentary had just claimed that the traditional number associated with the devil "666" is translated wrongly..
The actual number should be "616", refering the emperor Nero..
Ta-dah.. Bible's content (especially the translated ones) might not be accurate word for word..
especially all those prophatic preachers who used the number in their visions and teaching. -
DOnch noe why the topic starts to include other religions, and if you are ignorant, pls dont start discussing abt other religions
coz i see something statements like "God send Jesus and Buddha to earth"
since when Buddhism, has a God? -
but that's not the point.Originally posted by Ito_^:not exactly, fact is true believers still end up doing good anyways even if they are already guaranteed a place in heaven. thats the admirable part.
the point is that you can be a believer in the Christian faith but does evil.. everytime i do something evil, I will think that "hey, I'm weak and have succumb to the work of the devil. I will go to church this weekend and God will forgive me for cutting the head off a stray dog which was minding its own business."
Doesn't it sound strange to you that an Almighty God will "reward" someone like him, and banish, say a Nobel Peace Prize winner, to hell cos he's a Buddhist?
I'm not asking for quotes from the bible, but am appealing to your common logic. Doesn't this argument sounds flawed?
If this is the case, then how does the Christian teaching actually motivates its believer to do good? -
me too. new aged ideas, i noe.. rojak religion.Originally posted by earthlings73:the monotheistic and the reincarnation schools are very different in their philosophies.. hence, was kind of surprised to hear reincarnation being part of christians beliefs.. -
Personally, I dont really believe in Christian way of defining God, even if there is one.
All these about one guy who was god's son and come to eath to sacrifice for the humans, blah blah, sounds like one, and seeing many christians who just love to go around telling people to go to hell if they dont believe in them...
In history, there are thousands of people who claim to be a god's prophet one way or another. I guess Jesus successfully marketed himself, to the extend everyone just take the Bible as the truth.
You guys realy dont know how silly u all look, -
and you believe man over God, as you rightly say... they claim and have not proven...ta dah, just proved you wrong... man has been trying to prove that God does not exist of that the bible is false for as long as time has been, but to those who have truly sought...they have beomce believers...Originally posted by earthlings73:One BBC documentary had just claimed that the traditional number associated with the devil "666" is translated wrongly..
The actual number should be "616", refering the emperor Nero..
Ta-dah.. Bible's content (especially the translated ones) might not be accurate word for word..
Revelations 13:18 18This calls for wisdom. If anyone has insight, let him calculate the number of the beast, for it is man's number. His number is 666. -
haha.. totally agree.. was laughing too when i read that.Originally posted by laurence82:coz i see something statements like "God send Jesus and Buddha to earth"
since when Buddhism, has a God? 
Basically, Buddhism does not believe in an Almighty God. It doesn't care if there is. The main aim is to free your self from suffering by following the eightfold path to enlightenment.
And Unlike Christianity and Islam, Buddhas are not Prophets of god, but rather, they are beings that are enlightened cos they have followed the way. -
Seriously, a lot of the Christians hardly talk about doing good in the common sense, like helping poor people, donate to charity, be kind to peopleOriginally posted by k4korny:but that's not the point.
the point is that you can be a believer in the Christian faith but does evil.. everytime i do something evil, I will think that "hey, I'm weak and have succumb to the work of the devil. I will go to church this weekend and God will forgive me for cutting the head off a stray dog which was minding its own business."
Doesn't it sound strange to you that an Almighty God will "reward" someone like him, and banish, say a Nobel Peace Prize winner, to hell cos he's a Buddhist?
I'm not asking for quotes from the bible, but am appealing to your common logic. Doesn't this argument sounds flawed?
If this is the case, then how does the Christian teaching actually motivates its believer to do good?
Many simply said, to be good, must accept God yada yada, even if they are a big hypocrites themseleves. Everything thing they do, even if not right, is just referred to the Bible, becoz the bible says so...god becomes an excuse for everything they do...sigh -
well then laurence82, we will see who has the last laugh... and who looks sillier... when Jesus comes back again..Originally posted by laurence82:Personally, I dont really believe in Christian way of defining God, even if there is one.
All these about one guy who was god's son and come to eath to sacrifice for the humans, blah blah, sounds like one, and seeing many christians who just love to go around telling people to go to hell if they dont believe in them...
In history, there are thousands of people who claim to be a god's prophet one way or another. I guess Jesus successfully marketed himself, to the extend everyone just take the Bible as the truth.
You guys realy dont know how silly u all look, -
They didnt go out to prove that there's no god.. Just that messages from the original bible might not always be translated or transferred or interpreted correctly through the ages..Originally posted by breytonhartge:and you believe man over God, as you rightly say... they claim and have not proven...ta dah, just proved you wrong... man has been trying to prove that God does not exist of that the bible is false for as long as time has been, but to those who have truly sought...they have beomce believers...
Revelations 13:18 18This calls for wisdom. If anyone has insight, let him calculate the number of the beast, for it is man's number. His number is 666.
Sigh.. -
Thats why many a times, wheneve I step in to EH, i always sighOriginally posted by k4korny:haha.. totally agree.. was laughing too when i read that.
Basically, Buddhism does not believe in an Almighty God. It doesn't care if there is. The main aim is to free your self from suffering by following the eightfold path to enlightenment.
And Unlike Christianity and Islam, Buddhas are not Prophets of god, but rather, they are beings that are enlightened cos they have followed the way.
The focus of the topics in EH, is always two things
Against Catholicism, when there used to be a great number of anti Catholic topics around this year and last, even Christians themselves condem Catholic teachings to the point, i almost tot they, but not God, condems all Catholics ot hell
The focus always revolves around some silly discussion, without full understanding about other religions which always make me laugh, If a Christian hope to spread peace and love on this already war weary world, he still advocate hatred, misunderstanding and conflicts with other religions?
Hypocritical, simply hypocritical.... -
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No worries man..Originally posted by Ito_^:the question wld be, is BBC documentary to be trusted? and wad would be the reaction of the religous orders when its confirmed as true.
especially all those prophatic preachers who used the number in their visions and teaching.
The church has survived for so long.. After misinterpreting the bible so many times..
The age of the earth..
Earth being the centre of the universe..
Man being descendant of the primate family..
Mary Magdalene being a apostle, and being as important as the other 12 male apostles..
The bibles unearth in Eygpt in 1945..
So I dont see how such information will shake the church anyhow.. -
Originally posted by breytonhartge:well then laurence82, we will see who has the last laugh... and who looks sillier... when Jesus comes back again..
I seen the people like u for the nth time in this forum, and thank goodness, my frens, even if they are from CHC, arent like you.
You can take your Bible thumping stance away, i dont think you are well appreaciated here.... -
den that is not a true believer. its called "cheap grace". and no.. but i wish i can quote from the Bible on the fly though, but i can't.Originally posted by k4korny:but that's not the point.
the point is that you can be a believer in the Christian faith but does evil.. everytime i do something evil, I will think that "hey, I'm weak and have succumb to the work of the devil. I will go to church this weekend and God will forgive me for cutting the head off a stray dog which was minding its own business."
Doesn't it sound strange to you that an Almighty God will "reward" someone like him, and banish, say a Nobel Peace Prize winner, to hell cos he's a Buddhist?
I'm not asking for quotes from the bible, but am appealing to your common logic. Doesn't this argument sounds flawed?
If this is the case, then how does the Christian teaching actually motivates its believer to do good?
so it boils down to God's secret formulae to determine if a person is true or not .. other den dat, i've no ideas and wun try to push it to make myself sound holy.
personally, im sure those who enter heaven, are good nuff. basically, if you believe in the Lord, you will go about having "Biblical moral values", and should not be weak towards sin. those dat u mention is what it says "abuse of grace".
so.. ill juz type down this set of daily devotion journal thingie dat i got from my church.Twntieth century theologian Dietrich Bonhoeffer coined the term "cheap grace" as a way of summerizing grace abuse. Living in Nazi Germany, he was appalled by the cowardly way in which Christians were responding to Hitler's threat. Lutheran pastors preached grace from the pulpit on Sundays, then kept quiet the rest of the week as the Nazis pursued their policies of racism, euthanasia and finally genocide. Bonhoeffer's book, The Cost of Discipleship, highlights the many New Testament passages commanding Christians to attain holiness. Every call to conversion, he insists, includes a call to discipleship, to Christlikeness.
well.. this is the official stance on the "True Grace of God" for City Harvest.
God's grace can be "abused" when we do not understand what it is and its purpose in our lives. So let's understand what is true grace:
1. Gace empowers you to live in God's righteousness. It is God's grace that enables us to live in his Righteousness through faith in Jesus Christ. The Bible says we are saved by grace through faith (Eph. 2:3) Romans 5:17 adds, "For if by the one man's offense death reigned through the one, much more those receive abundance of grace and of th gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ."
2. Grace empowers you to work hard. Paul says, "But by the grace of God I am what I am, and His grace toward me was not in vain; but I labored more abundantly than they all, yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me" (1 Cor 15:10)
3. Grace empowers you to serve God (1 Pet. 4:10).
The grace of God doesn't make you passive, complacent, lazy or apathetic. On the contrary, grace teaches you to do what is right adbear the fruit of it. True grace is the power of God that enables yout to live a life that fullfills God's purpose.
and yes, this weakness is found in everyone who wants the easy way out. including me. strange it may be, but a theologian, or any Christian could argue by saying ".. God's ways are higher than man's way, thus its up to him."
its a faith right? -
then I would say that you do not know what you are talking about, many christians do a lot of good for the world out there... especially in africaOriginally posted by laurence82:Seriously, a lot of the Christians hardly talk about doing good in the common sense, like helping poor people, donate to charity, be kind to people
Many simply said, to be good, must accept God yada yada, even if they are a big hypocrites themseleves. Everything thing they do, even if not right, is just referred to the Bible, becoz the bible says so...god becomes an excuse for everything they do...sigh
Bruce Wilkinson, Joyce Meyer, Kenneth Copeland, Benny Hinn, New Creation Church, etc... the list goes on...
God is not my excuse for doing things, He is the reason why I do things and Jesus is my reason for who I am,
you have no uderstanding of how it works... because we know a God that loves us so much, we don't want to sin or do bad things... just the opposite, Knowing Christ will change a persons character around to do good and not evil as you define it... many stories about prison covicts who have received Christ and have turned their lives around... so becareful...
the problem with you all is that you are focusing on people who are fallable and not on God who is infallable. Christians even if saved are still human, but God is God... -
.. toking about me arh.Originally posted by laurence82:Thats why many a times, wheneve I step in to EH, i always sigh
The focus of the topics in EH, is always two things
Against Catholicism, when there used to be a great number of anti Catholic topics around this year and last, even Christians themselves condem Catholic teachings to the point, i almost tot they, but not God, condems all Catholics ot hell
The focus always revolves around some silly discussion, without full understanding about other religions which always make me laugh, If a Christian hope to spread peace and love on this already war weary world, he still advocate hatred, misunderstanding and conflicts with other religions?
Hypocritical, simply hypocritical.... -
come on lar, like i said, stop making statements, perform some good works might be more convincing...Originally posted by breytonhartge:then I would say that you do not know what you are talking about, many christians do a lot of good for the world out there... especially in africa
Bruce Wilkinson, Joyce Meyer, Kenneth Copeland, Benny Hinn, New Creation Church, etc... the list goes on...
God is not my excuse for doing things, He is the reason why I do things and Jesus is my reason for who I am,
you have no uderstanding of how it works... because we know a God that loves us so much, we don't want to sin or do bad things... just the opposite, Knowing Christ will change a persons character around to do good and not evil as you define it... many stories about prison covicts who have received Christ and have turned their lives around... so becareful...
the problem with you all is that you are focusing on people who are fallable and not on God who is infallable. Christians even if saved are still human, but God is God...
you know you are fallable, and you still dare preach? duh!
Anyway, these stories are created by Christians themselves. Unlike beatifying a Saint, there is no rigorous procedure to certify these stories are true, so anyone can come up with any cock and bull story
Anyway, I always tot the bible makes a good night story book for the anaemic... -
if you fit into any of the description, then its you lor....Originally posted by Ito_^:.. toking about me arh.
if you dont, then its not lor... -
And this goes on and on.
Very unhealthy. -
nah im not, i don't really care. the arguments could go both sides, and pastors could easily dismiss it as an act of the Devil trying to dilute the reputation of the Bible.Originally posted by earthlings73:No worries man..
The church has survived for so long.. After misinterpreting the bible so many times..
The age of the earth..
Earth being the centre of the universe..
Man being descendant of the primate family..
Mary Magdalene being a apostle, and being as important as the other 12 male apostles..
The bibles unearth in Eygpt in 1945..
So I dont see how such information will shake the church anyhow..
im juz wondering how would they react to it, in reality. it may not be what i am expecting, or it will be fused out by the bud.
check out american athetist webbie, there was this guy who pushed a policy to force inmates to attend church. legalism might work towards religious advantages, often. -
do you know how unhealthy for me to be sitting in the office for 7 hours per day reading topics in the bar?Originally posted by M©+square:And this goes on and on.
Very unhealthy.
now dats VERY UNHEALTHY. -
Im not advocating Christians to worship any other gods, Im saying if you are christian be a good christian, if you are a muslim, be a good muslim. Reincarnation exists, whether you believe it or not is another thing.Originally posted by Ito_^:hey hey i suddenly imagine wad my pastor would reply.
he would say...
den you are a moral man, not a Godly man!
no serious, he will definitely say dat. by faith, and complicated chemical math calculations in my head.
for me, ya, life is suffering, bible contents might be different from the original depending on versions and translation.
but there are many words that remained constant, and one of them refer to reaching God through Jesus and Jesus alone. many things didn't change. really.
thats why its incorrect to force the idea of reincarnation (actually, u were refering to regeneration, not reincarnation, different things) and the idea of going through other mediums to reach God, to Christians.
not to partake in Holy Communion is one thing, but advocating a Christian to worship to Buddha as though he is Christ is another thing altogether.
A godly man may not be a moral man.
A moral may not be a godly man.