Things you want to know about Christianity
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There are only 10 by God Himself stated as commendmants from OT and 2 from NT stated by Jesus.Originally posted by dragg:allow me to interrupt. it serves no purpose going at it point by point. there are in total over 400 commandments from GOD. not just the 10 that most people know.
Are you perhaps refering to the 613 laws of the Jews given to them by Moses and such? -
Of, course God must be treated as he is master. But that treatment is out of love. Jesus used harsh parables for emphasis. The bottomline is that true Christians obey God out of love.
Why not out of fear ? Tat is why he is describe as being harsh isn't it ? Tat is why the bible elaborated about how God punish people who do not obeyThrough loving your neighbour you express love for God, thus both parts are fufiled.
loving your neighbour does not express his love for something he don't believe or in some other entities tat runs in contrary to the god describe. U can't assume he love god because he is goodIn short, I believe this:
Wat about the verse when jesus say tat he is the only route to heaven ? I am pretty sure some people do not believe in the existence of one god and surely never keep the sabbath day holy. They already run contradictory to the 10 commandments. But u r trying to say tat theses rules r not applicable without really giving a reason to it, it is much like there is a rule in school tat says students must not cheat in exam. Then u says tat the all the rules meant tat student should treat other students well. So if the student cheats, he is not breaking the rule since treating other students well does not means u cannot cheat in exams. U r clearly and blatantly breaking the rules of the 10 commandments by believing other gods and not keeping the sabbath day holy. However u totally ignore tat point and says tat being good to neighbour is enough. They r not obeying the 10 commandments because they had clearly broke them. And about jesus, he taught 2 things. If u only follow one of them, u r not following him at all. It is like saying there r 100 rules to follow in a school, u have to follow all these 100 rules, not just follow any one of them and think u r safe.
1.For non-believers they fufill the two commendmants when they love thier neighbour thereby obeying all 10 commendmants. Hence they are eligible for heaven.
2. More , importantly, even a Christian which means both faith(prerequiste) and faith inspired works, who has led the best possible life is only saved,by the grace of God.
1. Did non-believers break the commandment "Thou shall keep the sabbath day holy" ?
2. Is it one of the commandments ?
3. Can a people who break many of the commandments able to go to heaven ?
3. Did jesus says tat the old laws r equally important as the new ones ?
4. Did jesus mention he is the only way to heaven
5. Did jesus emphasis a lot on how to "love god"
6. Do non-believers love god ?
7. Can a person who had not follow jesus's teachings able to go to heaven ?Love for God can be expressed in loving one's neighbour. There is a vast difference between being loving and being good. People cannot love and break the 10 commandments at the same time.
I don't see the link where loving one's neighbour is equal to loving god. U can't love something u don't believe. U don't love other people for his sake either. The 10 commandments had explicitly mention wat these rules r like. U cannot just summarise as u please. If tat is the case god should have summarised it out at tat time. He is suppose to be perfect and therefore can express wat he wants. R u thinking tat he cannot express wat he thinks properly ? R u correcting his grammer and language ? R u thinking u r a better philosopher than he ? If he express tat keeping the sabbath day holy is important, I don't think u have the rights to say it is not. -
Originally posted by stupidissmart:
u said ' y not believe in science? '
I say everything may be created out of nothing. Nothing out of nothing has no meaning at all
our science currently states that things cannot be created out of nothing.
' nothing out of nothing ' means that everything have to be created out of something. -
u said ' y not believe in science? '
science reach up till the big bang. So u should believe the science up till then. However personally I think tat somewhere the line everything was created out of nothing. Tat statement is not science now since it was not verified nor got evidences to say it is true. Tat is just my personal opinion of wat really creates out things. But if u say tat the big bang is created by god, which is another un-verified nor got evidences to show it is true, then I can also come up with my logic tat everything was created out of nothing, since even god need to be created and only "nothing" can avoid being created.
our science currently states that things cannot be created out of nothing.
' nothing out of nothing ' means that everything have to be created out of something. -
in simple yes/no...Originally posted by stupidissmart:1. Did non-believers break the commandment "Thou shall keep the sabbath day holy" ?
2. Is it one of the commandments ?
3. Can a people who break many of the commandments able to go to heaven ?
3. Did jesus says tat the old laws r equally important as the new ones ?
4. Did jesus mention he is the only way to heaven
5. Did jesus emphasis a lot on how to "love god"
6. Do non-believers love god ?
7. Can a person who had not follow jesus's teachings able to go to heaven ?
1. Yes.
2. Yes.
3. Yes. Condition is he has to be born again.
3. (You have two '3's.) Yes.
4. Yes.
5. No.
6. No.
7. No. -
sorry i dont really remember. i went to trinity college once and they told me all in all the whole Bible has about 400 over laws to follow.Originally posted by plo30360:There are only 10 by God Himself stated as commendmants from OT and 2 from NT stated by Jesus.
Are you perhaps refering to the 613 laws of the Jews given to them by Moses and such? -
been reading your previous post abt science. have not touched your replied posts yet. having exams of late... sorry.
but the points hor, you raised? very hilarious!
i am serious. you better get a reality check. i feel you have made this into a all too personal crusade.
we believe in God and Jesus Christ. the words you say set us about on the task of increasing our knowledge of Him and making us appreciate His word even more. if you were intending on converting people to atheism or the religion of attacking other's faiths, well sad to say you have failed.
i note you sometimes skirt around the issue when we have replied each one and every one of your questions directly.
its like explaining to you the law of gravity and then you saying the law of gravity cannot be obeyed, like for example in a black hole how do you know if the law of gravity does apply? just an example to tell you how we feel about your logic. its analogous the way u argue about specifics like the number of commandments in the Bible....
let me tell you. Christianity is a lifestyle. a lifestyle of loving God, glorifying God, recognizing our insignificance, humbling ourself and loving others in recognition there is someone infinitely greater than us in this Life. I think a life without faith is very meaningless for there would definitely have no explanation for the value system we have now?
can i ask you? why do we humans behave the way we are?
and hey ask you something, did we Christians offend you one way or the other? if so, why not share it here? we will be willing to listen. there are always some people who give Christianity a bad name. -
When we say harsh, we mean the words He used.
Why not out of fear ? Tat is why he is describe as being harsh isn't it ? Tat is why the bible elaborated about how God punish people who do not obey
A person may not believe in God(mind the context) but he loves God when he loves his neighbour.
loving your neighbour does not express his love for something he don't believe or in some other entities tat runs in contrary to the god describe. U can't assume he love god because he is good
(mind the context). Jesus said He is the way and the truth. This way and the truth is about love. As for JesusÂ’ 2 commandments:
Wat about the verse when jesus say tat he is the only route to heaven ? I am pretty sure some people do not believe in the existence of one god and surely never keep the sabbath day holy. They already run contradictory to the 10 commandments. But u r trying to say tat theses rules r not applicable without really giving a reason to it, it is much like there is a rule in school tat says students must not cheat in exam. Then u says tat the all the rules meant tat student should treat other students well. So if the student cheats, he is not breaking the rule since treating other students well does not means u cannot cheat in exams. U r clearly and blatantly breaking the rules of the 10 commandments by believing other gods and not keeping the sabbath day holy. However u totally ignore tat point and says tat being good to neighbour is enough. They r not obeying the 10 commandments because they had clearly broke them. And about jesus, he taught 2 things. If u only follow one of them, u r not following him at all. It is like saying there r 100 rules to follow in a school, u have to follow all these 100 rules, not just follow any one of them and think u r safe.
1. To love God with all your heart
2. To love your neighbour as yourself.
Since loving God can be expressed in loving oneÂ’s neighbour, both are fufiled. BTW there is that vast difference between being good to someone as opposed to loving someone.
1. Did non-believers break the commandment "Thou shall keep the sabbath day holy" ?
No because they possibly cannot honour the Sabbath day in the Christian manner. But they do keep it because, the whole point of keeping the Sabbath day holy is to love God and since loving can be expressed in loving oneÂ’s neighbour, they fufil the requirement.
2. Is it one of the commandments ?
Yes
3. Can a people who break many of the commandments able to go to heaven ?
(mind the context) All Christians break the commandments(sin) at one point of their life or another, hereÂ’s is where they beg forgiveness from God and not do it again.
3. Did jesus says tat the old laws r equally important as the new ones ?
Yes
4. Did jesus mention he is the only way to heaven
Yes
5. Did jesus emphasis a lot on how to "love god"
Yes
6. Do non-believers love god ?
Yes but not the way Christians do
7. Can a person who had not follow jesus's teachings able to go to heaven ?
Depends whether the fufillment of the 2 commandments is achieved.
On the contrary I did not summarise as I pleased:
don't see the link where loving one's neighbour is equal to loving god. U can't love something u don't believe. U don't love other people for his sake either. The 10 commandments had explicitly mention wat these rules r like. U cannot just summarise as u please. If tat is the case god should have summarised it out at tat time. He is suppose to be perfect and therefore can express wat he wants. R u thinking tat he cannot express wat he thinks properly ? R u correcting his grammer and language ? R u thinking u r a better philosopher than he ? If he express tat keeping the sabbath day holy is important, I don't think u have the rights to say it is not.
'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbour as yourself.' All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments." (Matthew 22:37-40 NIV) -
I don't see the link where loving one's neighbour is equal to loving god. U can't love something u don't believe. U don't love other people for his sake either. The 10 commandments had explicitly mention wat these rules r like. U cannot just summarise as u please. If tat is the case god should have summarised it out at tat time. He is suppose to be perfect and therefore can express wat he wants. R u thinking tat he cannot express wat he thinks properly ? R u correcting his grammer and language ? R u thinking u r a better philosopher than he ? If he express tat keeping the sabbath day holy is important, I don't think u have the rights to say it is not.
i'll reply just this one
Loving God comes first. We need to recignise Him, read His word, praise Him, and eventually fall in love with Him for all His wonders in the world become much more evident to us. This is what we do. Perhaps you can condemn but we wun defend ourselves because is what we believe.
Second commandment... what Jesus meant is to express God's love towards others. To follow Jesus means is expressing God's love to others, the feelings of compassion as well as humilty.
The 10 commandments are VERY explicit. But do you TRULY understand it? Remember the Bible has been handed down from generation to generation and those translations have unintentionally lost some of the emphasis/clarity of some words. HOWEVER! We are all guided by the HOLY SPIRIT. God is perfect. Its us who cant even comprehend the Bible. Even some of those scholars are tearing out their hair in frustration answering atheist scientists... anf in fact why not try emailing them your questions? Emailing a pastor or bishop can really help too! Because they understand the Bible much better than us.
Its like asking a primary school kid that a live electric wire is dangerous and why birds sitting on them does not get fried? nevertheless, we are glad to answer your questions to the best of our ability.
Keeping the Sabbath Day HOLY, what does it mean? The Jewish had a long list of laws like no work should be done on the Sabbath Day. Jesus went against that and healed a man on the Sabbath and essentially signed his death warrant (though alot of more events were to happen). Sabbath Day is a day of rememberance of God. We just celebrate it by going to church, singing songs of worship to him to celebrate knowing God and to recognise Him. We are also tempted to serve in the various ministries every Sunday, be it welfare, be it simple tasks, be it part of the service itself?
well thats my interpretation.
i wun bother arguing about this Sabbath Day thingy because for most, its just another Sunday. but hor, it doesnt mean only on the Sabbath then i wear my halo? its more like a very special day we Christians are called to celebrate our rebirth. -
Exactly
its like explaining to you the law of gravity and then you saying the law of gravity cannot be obeyed, like for example in a black hole how do you know if the law of gravity does apply? -
5. No
For question 3, wat do u mean by born again ? I am surprise u say question 5 is a no. Didn't jesus teach people on how to approach god ?we believe in God and Jesus Christ. the words you say set us about on the task of increasing our knowledge of Him and making us appreciate His word even more. if you were intending on converting people to atheism or the religion of attacking other's faiths, well sad to say you have failed.
Really ? then u should encourage me to write more instead isn't it ? Why discourage me from continuing ?i note you sometimes skirt around the issue when we have replied each one and every one of your questions directly.
R u sure about tis
There r a lot of points tat were never seen any replies again after I had put it down.its like explaining to you the law of gravity and then you saying the law of gravity cannot be obeyed, like for example in a black hole how do you know if the law of gravity does apply? just an example to tell you how we feel about your logic. its analogous the way u argue about specifics like the number of commandments in the Bible....
Why do u think the law of gravity does not apply to the black holelet me tell you. Christianity is a lifestyle. a lifestyle of loving God, glorifying God, recognizing our insignificance, humbling ourself and loving others in recognition there is someone infinitely greater than us in this Life. I think a life without faith is very meaningless for there would definitely have no explanation for the value system we have now?
On the contrary, I believe tat a lifestyle without faith is a lifestyle tat was liberated. No longer do u have to tilth, u find u have more time and less restrictions to do the things u want. I find a life being a slave to something and everything in life is predestined is the meaningless life to pursue.can i ask you? why do we humans behave the way we are?
Because of our interation with society and its education toward us.and hey ask you something, did we Christians offend you one way or the other? if so, why not share it here? we will be willing to listen. there are always some people who give Christianity a bad name.
The only thing I can think is 2 ladies knocking on my door trying to convert me to christainity. However tat is a real minor event I am writing not because I want revenge or anything, do't assume I must have some bad incidents with christians just because of the things I write. I write is really because I think it is foolish to follow a religion tat appears to be so false to me. -
err last replyOriginally posted by stupidissmart:The only thing I can think is 2 ladies knocking on my door trying to convert me to christainity. However tat is a real minor event I am writing not because I want revenge or anything, do't assume I must have some bad incidents with christians just because of the things I write. I write is really because I think it is foolish to follow a religion tat appears to be so false to me.
im so sorry that im really busy struggling for my exams. no we arent discouraging you! we love to talk about our faith! perhaps we can find out we have been glossing over some issues and might have forgotten the others! we thank you really.
but its ya tone. i assume cos u sound rather bitter and resentful to us. we feel rather hurt. this previous post really had a vast improvement in tone. try to be friendlier to us and we'll be too happy to share what we believe. please do not judge us cos of what we believe in. look at what we do instead. if we didn't really harm you or attack you, perhaps you could try to be frinedlier to us. its an incentive to continue talking to you.
"I write is really because I think it is foolish to follow a religion tat appears to be so false to me."
sigh... it struck a chord with me. i was once like you thinking religion was a waste of time. for the past 15 years of my life previously, (i am now 21), i thought like you and rejected my cradle Christian privelege. i seriously thought God was a waste of time and wanted something tangible to convince me of my beliefs. well to cut a long story short, i became a Christian again due to some powerful event in my life to recognise the true power of faith! i'll elaborate someday.
its a faith. never a theory. never an axiom. never a topic. its something your heart believes in and is willing to even die for. sounds weird. i useed to think that way. well don't worry about that.... perhaps tone down your harsh comments and continue our discussion
God has a plan for everyone we believe. so i'll leave it to Him. But seriously, we just want to share our faith, not force people to convert. Conversion MUST be done willingly then it can be called a rebirth.
thanks.
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When we say harsh, we mean the words He used.
is the actions he used harsh or not ?A person may not believe in God(mind the context) but he loves God when he loves his neighbour.
why do u asume tat he love god when he love his neighbour ? I love jane doesn't means I love JackJesus said He is the way and the truth. This way and the truth is about love. As for JesusÂ’ 2 commandments:
why is loving god expressed the same as loving your neighbour ?
1. To love God with all your heart
2. To love your neighbour as yourself.
Since loving God can be expressed in loving oneÂ’s neighbour, both are fufiled. BTW there is that vast difference between being good to someone as opposed to loving someone. Buddhist love their neighbour but certainly do not love your god. Only one is fulfilled. Loving your neighbour has nothing to do with loving god.No because they possibly cannot honour the Sabbath day in the Christian manner. But they do keep it because, the whole point of keeping the Sabbath day holy is to love God and since loving can be expressed in loving oneÂ’s neighbour, they fufil the requirement
I don't tink u have the right to tell us tat the point of keeping sabbath day is to love god and then tell us it is linked to loving neighbour. U might as well say tat black is related to hair and hair is related to sadako and sadako is related to japanese so being black is being japanese. The conculsions u got is wrong since keeping the sabbath day is not only to love god but also to do ctions to show how to love god. Loving god is different from loving your neighbour too since a person can love god but incapable of loving all its neighbours.(mind the context) All Christians break the commandments(sin) at one point of their life or another, hereÂ’s is where they beg forgiveness from God and not do it again.
how about a person who never follow many commandments for his whole life ?Depends whether the fufillment of the 2 commandments is achieved
how can it be cahieved when they don't love god.On the contrary I did not summarise as I pleased
u r not really answering the questions posed in the passage. If sabbath day is nothign mroe than loving neighbours, why do god want to write it down as such ? U r corecting god isn't it ?'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbour as yourself.' All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments
They r stating 2 factors, not the only two things to consider and they never say they r the more important commandments nor all the laws and prophet hanging on these 2 factors. The verses and your conclusion don't matchLoving God comes first. We need to recignise Him, read His word, praise Him, and eventually fall in love with Him for all His wonders in the world become much more evident to us. This is what we do. Perhaps you can condemn but we wun defend ourselves because is what we believe.
so non-believers go to hell or go to heaven ? They clearly do not love god since they don't believe he exists. BTW why will one eventually love god when all in the bible it shows how harsh he is to menSecond commandment... what Jesus meant is to express God's love towards others. To follow Jesus means is expressing God's love to others, the feelings of compassion as well as humilty.
Jesus also meant tat love to god is still needed. He also states tat god is a harsh master tat is not easily pleased.The 10 commandments are VERY explicit. But do you TRULY understand it? Remember the Bible has been handed down from generation to generation and those translations have unintentionally lost some of the emphasis/clarity of some words. HOWEVER! We are all guided by the HOLY SPIRIT. God is perfect. Its us who cant even comprehend the Bible. Even some of those scholars are tearing out their hair in frustration answering atheist scientists... anf in fact why not try emailing them your questions? Emailing a pastor or bishop can really help too! Because they understand the Bible much better than us.
So wat r u trying to say ? The bible is wrong after 2000 years ? Then the NT can be wrong as well since it is also very old. The wording and your whole religion is founded on words tat have lost its accuracy and relevance over time ? Holy spirit ? Maybe the part about being guided by holy spirits is wrong too. There is not such things as holy spirits, it is just some badly translated verses over time. God is perfect ? How can he when the words he said had to change over time when he claim it does not ? How can he when he can't write the bible so tat everyone can understand it ? So christianity is a religion where the bible can only be interpreted by the few priviledge people like bishop or pastor ? God do not like mentally challenged people to read the bible ? The mentally challenged people had to be in a greater rick of being non-believer since they can't interprete the bible ? It is purposelly made difficult so nobody really understand, even scholars ? I don't know how to otherwise phrase tis para other than asking like tisKeeping the Sabbath Day HOLY, what does it mean? The Jewish had a long list of laws like no work should be done on the Sabbath Day. Jesus went against that and healed a man on the Sabbath and essentially signed his death warrant (though alot of more events were to happen). Sabbath Day is a day of rememberance of God. We just celebrate it by going to church, singing songs of worship to him to celebrate knowing God and to recognise Him. We are also tempted to serve in the various ministries every Sunday, be it welfare, be it simple tasks, be it part of the service itself?
So wat does Jesus went agains the jews means ? Another bible contradiction ? Sunday is celebrated by songs and church for some christians but for non-believers they probably do the thigns they wanna do. They r not keeping sabbath day holy. U can't keep it holy by not doing anything different from normal daysbut its ya tone. i assume cos u sound rather bitter and resentful to us. we feel rather hurt. this previous post really had a vast improvement in tone. try to be friendlier to us and we'll be too happy to share what we believe. please do not judge us cos of what we believe in. look at what we do instead. if we didn't really harm you or attack you, perhaps you could try to be frinedlier to us. its an incentive to continue talking to you.
My tone is the same in every other places, not just in eternal hope. Please don't assume I am bitter and resentful to christians because I don't. i just find their belief to be really too incredulous to swallowits a faith. never a theory. never an axiom. never a topic. its something your heart believes in and is willing to even die for. sounds weird. i useed to think that way. well don't worry about that.... perhaps tone down your harsh comments and continue our discussion
Christianity do comes out a lot of theories, such as all animals were created in a single day. It is not just about wat your heart believe in, it is about believing in the truth. Your faith is verifiable and to me, it appears to be verified to be wrong, like young earth or evolution etc. Therefore it can be seen whether it is real or not. But strangely to me, most just ignore the facts it is proven wrong and they believe in it anyway.God has a plan for everyone we believe. so i'll leave it to Him. But seriously, we just want to share our faith, not force people to convert. Conversion MUST be done willingly then it can be called a rebirth.
And how to convert people willingly ? -
Based under what circumstances.
is the actions he used harsh or not ?
Its not an assupmtion.
why do u asume tat he love god when he love his neighbour ?
I love jane doesn't means I love Jack
There are verses to support that God percives love of neighbour as love of Him.
"The one who does not love does not know God, for God is love."
why is loving god expressed the same as loving your neighbour ?
Buddhist love their neighbour but certainly do not love your god. Only one is fulfilled.
Loving your neighbour has nothing to do with loving god.
( I John 4:8 )
By this verse, it can be stated even though a Buddhist does not love God
in the way a Christian might,he still expresses that love for God when he loves.
"If anyone says, "I love God," yet hates his brother, he is a liar.
I don't tink u have the right to tell us tat the point of keeping sabbath day is to love god
and then tell us it is linked to loving neighbour. U might as well say tat black is related
to hair and hair is related to sadako and sadako is related to japanese so being black is being japanese.
The conculsions u got is wrong since keeping the sabbath day is not only to love god but also to do ctions to show how to love god.
Loving god is different from loving your neighbour too since a person can love god but incapable of loving all its neighbours.
For anyone who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has not seen.
And he has given us this command: Whoever loves God must also love his brother."
(1 John 4:20-21)
As you can see its not possible to hate or not love your neighbour and love God at the same time.
A person who does not follow the 2 commandments, thus not following the 10 commandments
how about a person who never follow many commandments for his whole life ?
and does not repent, well obviously he rejects heaven.
It is achived for love for neighbour can be expressed as love for God.
how can it be cahieved when they don't love god.
I've answered the question many times. If you ask in a non-Christian context,
u r not really answering the questions posed in the passage.
If sabbath day is nothign mroe than loving neighbours,
why do god want to write it down as such ?
U r corecting god isn't it ?
then the answer is given. If you ask in a Christian context keeping the Sabbath day
holy is another form of love for God.
These are the 2 most important commandments for within them
They r stating 2 factors,
not the only two things to consider and
they never say they r the more important commandments
nor all the laws and prophet hanging on these 2 factors.
The verses and your conclusion don't match
are contained the 10 commandments. That is what is meant by the laws and prophets hanging on these two commandments and yes that line about the "laws and..." is part of the verse.
And since by loving neighbour, one can express love for God, it sums up both.
That is why in all the verses that mention both these commandments, the title is: The Great Commandment. -
big bang's unverified also, so y should it be considered science?Originally posted by stupidissmart:science reach up till the big bang. So u should believe the science up till then. However personally I think tat somewhere the line everything was created out of nothing. Tat statement is not science now since it was not verified nor got evidences to say it is true. Tat is just my personal opinion of wat really creates out things. But if u say tat the big bang is created by god, which is another un-verified nor got evidences to show it is true, then I can also come up with my logic tat everything was created out of nothing, since even god need to be created and only "nothing" can avoid being created.
how do u noe that even god needs to be created? maybe god n everything he has has always been there all the time. maybe humans n the universe that we know are the only things that needs creating.......... -
Big Bang is the best theory in explaining the cosmological phenomena. It follows scientific principles. Why it cannot be considered science?Originally posted by loseagain:big bang's unverified also, so y should it be considered science?
I'm sorry. We are not at a paradigm shift yet .. so big bang still stays with us as the best theory.
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cos there's no proof at all.Originally posted by Icemoon:Big Bang is the best theory in explaining the cosmological phenomena. It follows scientific principles. Why it cannot be considered science?
I'm sorry. We are not at a paradigm shift yet .. so big bang still stays with us as the best theory.
its merely a hypothesis. -
How about cosmic background radiation?Originally posted by loseagain:cos there's no proof at all.
its merely a hypothesis.
I'm not going into the details with you .. but do you mean there is absolutely no proof? Like if Big Bang says we should be able to detect/see/hear something according to the theory but to date we find nothing of such sort?