Creation Vs Evolution
-
well yeah, but the thing is.. christians believe that we've experience god in many forms.. so we believe loh.
there r many other people from their religion telling the same thingymaybe we're faking ourselves.. but on the whole i think the religon is a good one lah.. it's just that some people give christianity a good name..
I am sadly thinking of your lost income, time and effort into tis... the best religion is probably from my parents. wheneevr nothign happen, they go about their live living normally. when something cock up, then they pray to god and it still will help them. -
what signs do you mean that we are at the end of the line..?Originally posted by stupidissmart:if we r really at the end of the line, tat mean nothing is outside wat we preceive, then aren't we adding in an extra layer tat doesn't exists ? from the signs we see it may really means we r atthe end of the lone
basically, we believe that there is a guy outside the tank, we do not know (in the brain) that there is a guy outside the tank, but we feel (in our heart) that there is a guy outside the tank.
that's prob most religons in a nutshell..
just like we cannot show you "This is God".. you can't show us "There is no God".. -
True. That's why I don't think it's nice to whack other people's religon.. just mind our own business.Originally posted by stupidissmart:there r many other people from their religion telling the same thingy
They believe in X we believe in Y, you believe in nothing.. all live peacefully lah..
Well, this kind of thing is an "belief".. just the Opposition in Sg put in their income, time and effort into their political effort.. christians put theirs into Christianity. Of course we're not so jialat a life as the opposition lah.. but do we feel better in the end? I think Christians do (if Christians don't feel better being a christian then be one for what?Originally posted by stupidissmart:I am sadly thinking of your lost income, time and effort into tis... the best religion is probably from my parents. wheneevr nothign happen, they go about their live living normally. when something cock up, then they pray to god and it still will help them. ) -
what signs do you mean that we are at the end of the line..?
we have observed nothing tat tells us there is something out of our galaxythat's prob most religons in a nutshell.. just like we cannot show you "This is God".. you can't show us "There is no God"..
the burden of proving is on u to prove out a god. If u expect the others to prove u wrong, then anyone can claims anything they want. I say there is lochness monster somewhere. U can never give conclusive evidence to say it doesn't.
but basically I have shown to some extent if u had read the things I had wrote before. If your religion is true, then the things, events etc written in the bible should all be true. but tat appears not to be the case. -
Have you guys consider the possibility of "brains in jars"? There are times when I really believe that we are living in The Matrix.
-
True. That's why I don't think it's nice to whack other people's religon.. just mind our own business.
but then if u see someone kanna cheated out there will u tell him or let him continued to be lied upon ?
They believe in X we believe in Y, you believe in nothing.. all live peacefully lah..Well, this kind of thing is an "belief".. just the Opposition in Sg put in their income, time and effort into their political effort.. christians put theirs into Christianity. Of course we're not so jialat a life as the opposition lah.. but do we feel better in the end? I think Christians do (if Christians don't feel better being a christian then be one for what?
opposition do it for an ideal which is probably physically true. But in the case of religion it is belief on something which they think is true but in actual fact, not. Frankly some christian never knows if they r being better off or worse off since they never had a chance and was a born christian -
I can't prove that God exists with words.. true, to a certain extent comparing to loch ness monster is relavant, but there isn't any loch ness monster religon or church of loch ness right? We cannot live a loch ness life can weOriginally posted by stupidissmart:the burden of proving is on u to prove out a god. If u expect the others to prove u wrong, then anyone can claims anything they want. I say there is lochness monster somewhere. U can never give conclusive evidence to say it doesn't.
but basically I have shown to some extent if u had read the things I had wrote before. If your religion is true, then the things, events etc written in the bible should all be true. but tat appears not to be the case.
The most powerful christians converters are the ones who use their deeds and actions to show that God exists.. that's something that many of us can work on, including me..
like ghandi say about christianity "I like their Christ, but not their Christians."
about the things events .. i try my best to answer you? but that would mean starting another thread liao.. you create one loh then we discuss there -
Have you guys consider the possibility of "brains in jars"? There are times when I really believe that we are living in The Matrix
tat maybe possible but there is never a way to find it out...
i watched some show before when i was young and it is about a person living in his old hometown. however he later discover he was actually kidnapped and all the people around him r aliens trying to understand how men live and work. the whole world and everything he knew and see was actually made up by them. Something like truman show and matrix combined
anyway.. there r too many possible outcome tat an never be tested and personally I think it is more logical to believe in the one tat have the least assumptions now
gtg bye -
I can't prove that God exists with words.. true, to a certain extent comparing to loch ness monster is relavant, but there isn't any loch ness monster religon or church of loch ness right? We cannot live a loch ness life can we
however it means tat asking other people to prove an idea wrong instead of him proving himself right is unreasonableThe most powerful christians converters are the ones who use their deeds and actions to show that God exists.. that's something that many of us can work on, including me..
the only way they do tat is by performing miracles tat can never be explained and rigourously tested to be true. If they just do good deeds than frankly speaking anyone can do good deeds if they wantlike ghandi say about christianity "I like their Christ, but not their Christians."
I do not like christ but I like some christiansabout the things events .. i try my best to answer you? but that would mean starting another thread liao.. you create one loh then we discuss there
forget it ! if u really want u can go through the past threads here. -
well, I didn't ask you to prove me wrong did IOriginally posted by stupidissmart:however it means tat asking other people to prove an idea wrong instead of him proving himself right is unreasonable
well enough lah, we're off topic ald as it is -
It reminds me of the system in a certain country , that is, you are guilty until you prove yourself to be innocent
-
Sounds familiar.Originally posted by F Takumi:It reminds me of the system in a certain country , that is, you are guilty until you prove yourself to be innocent
Wait a minute, don't tell me .. !
-
The fundamental difference between Evolution and Creation (Christian) is that Evolution advocates that human beings are evolved from primates while Christian Creationism states that human beings are created in the image of God.
I personally have no objection to Creationism in that the Big Bang is created by some supreme being, but the Christian version of Genesis sounds too far fetched. -
Lets just the stipulated time frame tat the whole galaxy and human being made in a week is absurb. And they use the word "day" which was used repeatedly in the bible meaning as the usual 24 hours system we use
-
It is not absurb if told in the time frame of the eternal God.
And who discovered relativity? A Jew, the people of God.
How many times must I repeat this .. haiz -
The image of God refers to spiritual things. Come on, do you think God has a corporeal body?Originally posted by F Takumi:The fundamental difference between Evolution and Creation (Christian) is that Evolution advocates that human beings are evolved from primates while Christian Creationism states that human beings are created in the image of God.
Evolution refers to the change in physical structures over the years. It is accepted we are very very different from animals in spiritual aspects.
So your fundamental difference can be reconciled. -
It is not absurb if told in the time frame of the eternal God.
It is specifically mentioned as "day", the time where the sun rise and falls.
And who discovered relativity? A Jew, the people of God.
How many times must I repeat this .. haiz
God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.
A standard has been explicitly mentioned and it has nothing to do with relativity. Just like if someone say 10 metres, it meant 10 metres as stated in ISO, not any distance he want. They can be sued if they insist 10 metres is actually 10 miles in a contract. Day and night is the time frame which was supposed to be understood by human and "god". U cannot say day doesn't means day here. I also have reply tis many times before and people just totally ignore tis.The image of God refers to spiritual things. Come on, do you think God has a corporeal body?
The point about the previous reply is probably to highlight the men in the bible never change drastically. Men r made as we r, not evolved out from other beings. Men r supposedly created from dust. BTW where on earth does they say men and god r alike "spiritually" ? How do u know god do not have a corporeal body ? U never see him yourself either isn't it ?
Evolution refers to the change in physical structures over the years. It is accepted we are very very different from animals in spiritual aspects.
So your fundamental difference can be reconciled. -
Erm .. the sun wasn't even created on the first day, so the day wasn't even defined. If ISO or SI units weren't defined, your 10 metres is open to interpretation.Originally posted by stupidissmart:It is specifically mentioned as "day", the time where the sun rise and falls.
God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.
A standard has been explicitly mentioned and it has nothing to do with relativity. Just like if someone say 10 metres, it meant 10 metres as stated in ISO, not any distance he want. They can be sued if they insist 10 metres is actually 10 miles in a contract.
I don't accept the terms in your contract.
Men r supposedly created from dust. BTW where on earth does they say men and god r alike "spiritually" ? How do u know god do not have a corporeal body ? U never see him yourself either isn't it ?
There is no doubt that man is special, having received the neshama chayim from the breath of God. And then man became a nefesh chayah.
Jesus has a corporeal body and entered into our history. The eternal God entered into our temporal world. -
Erm .. the sun wasn't even created on the first day, so the day wasn't even defined. If ISO or SI units weren't defined, your 10 metres is open to interpretation.
He made light on day 0, it was the evening and morning as we saw it. Otherwise how do u explain morning and evening in the bible ? Why use the word "day" then ? How do u explain tis sentence to me
God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day
Even if u wanna deny, on day 4 the sun was suppsoed to eb created yet the very next day all animals were living happily and day 6 adam, the human was already here. The timeframe was still very wrong.There is no doubt that man is special, having received the neshama chayim from the breath of God. And then man became a nefesh chayah.
Ok, wat is your point ? It still never say tat we r alike spiritually and u still can't say tat god do not have a corporeal body. It is simply wat u think and it may very well be wrong
Jesus has a corporeal body and entered into our history. The eternal God entered into our temporal world. In fact jesus have a corporeal body and since jesus=god, then god have a corporeal body as well. So it maybe true tat we r created physically, just physically to be like god and the earlier statement mentioned by takumi is not wrong. -
You said "It is specifically mentioned as "day", the time where the sun rise and falls."Originally posted by stupidissmart:He made light on day 0, it was the evening and morning as we saw it. Otherwise how do u explain morning and evening in the bible ? Why use the word "day" then ? How do u explain tis sentence to me
Your interpretation of day is wrong, if you accept the sun wasn't created before yom echad.
Can go read the Jewish literature for some possible explanation.In fact jesus have a corporeal body and since jesus=god, then god have a corporeal body as well.
-_-
I just lost a few blood vessels after reading the above quote .. -
In Evolution, human beings evolved from primates which in turn were evolved from single cell organisms.Originally posted by Icemoon:The image of God refers to spiritual things. Come on, do you think God has a corporeal body?
Evolution refers to the change in physical structures over the years. It is accepted we are very very different from animals in spiritual aspects.
So your fundamental difference can be reconciled.
So unless you agree that God created single cell organisms and they eventually evolved into human, ie God did not create human directly, then Christianity and Science can reconcile. -
Actually adam is related to adamah, the Hebrew for ground. Not sure if you noticed that. Also note that God did not say "Let there be man and there was man".
The creation of Adam is a special creation, the act of God putting the neshamah chayim into the body supposedly formed from the dust of the ground. (existing material + divine endowment) IMHO, whether God sculptured Adam from ground dust literally is not important. Science will not know who is the first human to walk on planet Earth. Maybe God did mould the first human from ground dust? -
You said "It is specifically mentioned as "day", the time where the sun rise and falls."
Okie, the way they mention in the bible of "day" is morning and evening, a day.
Your interpretation of day is wrong, if you accept the sun wasn't created before yom echad.
Can go read the Jewish literature for some possible explanation.
god had created light on first day. It is possible for morning to occur. Otherwise, wat does the sentence means ? U mean they add the sentence to make them contradictory or laughable or something ? And wat happened after the 4th day ? surely u have to agree the sun was made then, he set up the standard timeline such as "day and night" and "seasons" etc. He even explicitly say tat the greater light governs the day (supposedly sun) and the lesser light the night. He explicitly use the word DAY for tis timeline. Yet on the next day it still shows tat all the animals were created on the same day and adam was created in the next day.In fact adam was able to name the animals and he able to name show tat they had evolved fully to the state they r in nowI just lost a few blood vessels after reading the above quote ..
U can only blame on the idea of trinity; making different objects to be oneScience will not know who is the first human to walk on planet Earth. Maybe God did mould the first human from ground dust?
Ahh... but science states tat men was evolved from apes. There is no such thing as a first man since they r continously changing to human then and we human r constantly evolving as well. There is no sudden jump where a clear definition can be set. It will very much depend on your definition of a first human. Should they be more apelike tat can barely stand upright like we see if fossils or the human in BC 0 ? And also according to science, there is no one being that suddenly becoming "human", but a large group of such being evolving into tat state together. So it is still wrong.
I don't know about u man, u don't think genesis is really fairy tale tat describe why there is sun or stars or animals ? As a normal adult human being, I find them similar to other folkstories or myth on how sun was created or human formed. -
Archaeological and genetic evidence have traced the origin of modern human beings to Africa. Maybe Eden is in Ethiopia.Originally posted by Icemoon:Actually adam is related to adamah, the Hebrew for ground. Not sure if you noticed that. Also note that God did not say "Let there be man and there was man".
The creation of Adam is a special creation, the act of God putting the neshamah chayim into the body supposedly formed from the dust of the ground. (existing material + divine endowment) IMHO, whether God sculptured Adam from ground dust literally is not important. Science will not know who is the first human to walk on planet Earth. Maybe God did mould the first human from ground dust?
Anyway, we won't know what is true until we have witnessed it. -
Ironically you are slowly drifting into the supernatural explanation. As we know, the day is defined in terms of the rising and setting of the sun, that's how our ancestors see it too. Now, as we are more advanced, we also know the rising and setting is due to the revolution of the Earth. Hence it is possible the sun already existed in day 1. But to believe this is to acknowledge indirectly that the author knows something about Earth revolution? After all, if he cannot see the sun in day 1 due to heavy clouds or something, how could he know the sun existed?Originally posted by stupidissmart:Okie, the way they mention in the bible of "day" is morning and evening, a day.
god had created light on first day. It is possible for morning to occur.Ahh... but science states tat men was evolved from apes. There is no such thing as a first man since they r continously changing to human then and we human r constantly evolving as well.
Anyone interested can read the Talmud Chagigah on pre-Adam hominid.